Snakes in the Chiricahua mountains

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Deng09
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Snakes in the Chiricahua mountains

Post by Deng09 »

Does anyone know where I can find a list of every possible snake that may occur in the Chiricahuas? I am going to be going on a camping trip there over the summer and wanted to see all the possibilities. Any advice for camping/herping in the area would be appreciated. The main two snakes I would be most excited to find would be the green rat snake and the hog nosed snake, but really anything.
NACairns
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Re: Snakes in the Chiricahua mountains

Post by NACairns »

Here is an old list by Charles Lowe and Richard Zweifel, just clip the link:
http://www.amnh.org/our-research/southw ... s/reptiles
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Steve Bledsoe
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Re: Snakes in the Chiricahua mountains

Post by Steve Bledsoe »

A Field Guide to Amphibians and Reptiles in Arizona

Image

You can find this book on Amazon, or purchase it directly from the Arizona Game & Fish Department.
It contains all of the state species with distribution maps.
Deng09
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Re: Snakes in the Chiricahua mountains

Post by Deng09 »

NACairns wrote:Here is an old list by Charles Lowe and Richard Zweifel, just clip the link:
http://www.amnh.org/our-research/southw ... s/reptiles
Exactly what I was looking for, thank you!!
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MarcLinsalata
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Re: Snakes in the Chiricahua mountains

Post by MarcLinsalata »

Steve Bledsoe wrote:A Field Guide to Amphibians and Reptiles in Arizona

Image

You can find this book on Amazon, or purchase it directly from the Arizona Game & Fish Department.
It contains all of the state species with distribution maps.
I picked this book up at a Fish and Game office when getting a temporary license. Pick this book up! It was I think $20 tops but it is super awesome and detailed.
robert
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Re: Snakes in the Chiricahua mountains

Post by robert »

Deng09:

Great place! I go every summer and will be there again this summer. I really like camping at the Sunny Flats Campground. And I eat at the restaurant at the Portal Lodge (check when it closes at night--I have missed a dinner). Also, bring your food with you--there are no 'grocery stores' nearby. And the nearest gas is in Animas, New Mexico on Route 9.

The book suggestion is right on. It is my 'Bible' for the ten days I spend in AZ. I don't think that Hogs are local, but there are plenty of other amazing species.

Good luck and maybe I will see you in early August at Sunny Flats.

Robert
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Steve Bledsoe
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Re: Snakes in the Chiricahua mountains

Post by Steve Bledsoe »

It's difficult to say how large of an area surrounding the Chiricahuas the Lowe/Zweifel list encompasses, but hogs are found locally in the right habitat.
NACairns
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Re: Snakes in the Chiricahua mountains

Post by NACairns »

Yep, I've cruised up hogs in the flats very near to the Chiri's.
Deng09
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Re: Snakes in the Chiricahua mountains

Post by Deng09 »

NACairns wrote:Yep, I've cruised up hogs in the flats very near to the Chiri's.
I saw that hogs occurred there when I was looking at this: http://www.reptilesofaz.org/Snakes-Subp ... erlyi.html

Are you saying I wont find them in the mountains?
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Steve Bledsoe
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Re: Snakes in the Chiricahua mountains

Post by Steve Bledsoe »

Deng09 wrote:Are you saying I wont find them in the mountains?
I guess it's possible to find them in the mountains, but not very probable in my experience.
NACairns
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Re: Snakes in the Chiricahua mountains

Post by NACairns »

I only saw two in six months but neither were in the mountains proper. Check the foothills and the flats during the day when it's not too hot (20-25C).
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canderson
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Re: Snakes in the Chiricahua mountains

Post by canderson »

You won't find Heterodon in the mountains, it is the wrong habitat for this species. They can be found in the flats in grasslands, and nearer to desert washes. The Chiri's can be very fruitless this time of year; and indeed any other time of year. To find all species of snakes is quite ambitious, I consider it a good trip if I find 3 or more species. I've gone several times in the right time of year and found none at all.

Regardless of what you find, or don't find, don't forget to enjoy the scenery and the peacefulness! A moonless clear night is spellbinding! Watch for satellites and enjoy the spectacular view of the desert mountains backdropped by the Milky Way.
Deng09
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Re: Snakes in the Chiricahua mountains

Post by Deng09 »

canderson wrote:You won't find Heterodon in the mountains, it is the wrong habitat for this species. They can be found in the flats in grasslands, and nearer to desert washes. The Chiri's can be very fruitless this time of year; and indeed any other time of year. To find all species of snakes is quite ambitious, I consider it a good trip if I find 3 or more species. I've gone several times in the right time of year and found none at all.

Regardless of what you find, or don't find, don't forget to enjoy the scenery and the peacefulness! A moonless clear night is spellbinding! Watch for satellites and enjoy the spectacular view of the desert mountains backdropped by the Milky Way.
What time of year would you recommend is best? I have heard it is somewhat dangerous in that area, any comment on that?
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Jeremy Wright
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Re: Snakes in the Chiricahua mountains

Post by Jeremy Wright »

Not sure what the other guys will say but I was in the Chiricahuas in September a couple years ago following a wet spell and the roads were literally filled with amphibians. We must have seen thousands of toads on the road, it was almost impossible not to hit them at some points. We saw atrox and mojaves and a couple dead hognose. I know people have been having good look cruising around the chiricahuas recently, and have been seeing upwards of 30 snakes some nights, which is way more then I saw when I was down there. I think the best time to go depends on what you want to see and the other Arizona guys that have much more experience then I do in that area should be able to give some more ideas!
-Jeremy
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Jeremy Wright
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Re: Snakes in the Chiricahua mountains

Post by Jeremy Wright »

One more thing. When I went we were based in the Southwestern Research Station and we hiked and cruised down into NM and also very close to the border, and we didn't have any problems. To be safe, I would avoid night hiking or camping nearer to the border, but I have friends that do it and besides the occasional spotting of a border crosser have had no problems.
FrogO_Oeyes
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Re: Snakes in the Chiricahua mountains

Post by FrogO_Oeyes »

We saw "14" making a cash run, I think, just north of the wall, south of the Chiricahuas. And someone else walking along the road with lots of clothes on at night, in the mountains. Herpwise, we saw one L.knoblochi in Rucker Canyon, along with many Sceloporus virgatus and S.poinsetti, and a few Elgaria. Elsewhere not a lot; one L.splendida, some roadkill Pituophis, a couple coachwhips if I recall, plus some Urosaurus and Aspidoscelis. Lots of mini scorpions, some giant centipedes, but not so much as one garter. Closer to Tucson, a S.magister, one Phrynosoma solare, some S.clarki and Holbrookia, one probable Callisaurus, one Coleonyx, Aspidoscelis sonorae, and some bark scorpions. This was May 2015. Scorpion numbers and diversity was awesome, amphibians were non-existant, lizards were hit and miss, and snakes were mainly roadkills [oh yeah, one dead Crotalus scutulatus]. The solitary Chihuahuan Mountain king was the only snake alive and not road-cruised.
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canderson
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Re: Snakes in the Chiricahua mountains

Post by canderson »

Hey Deng09, just catching up with these threads. Sorry for the late reply!

I've heard September is a great time to go! I've been once then and found the only Gila monster and lots of snakes. I think the best trip I've ever had was in July back in 1992; road cruising the flats was super productive. I think I found over 40 snakes that night representing 11 species as I recall. It was an awesome night I got to share with my friend Barney Tomberlin. Spring, although dry, can also be good in the mountains as snakes are getting active and before the heat comes on. May thru to the beginning of the monsoon can be extremely unproductive.

Have you gone on your trip yet? Would love to hear about it. I'll be heading that way soon!

Happy herping! :beer:
Deng09
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Re: Snakes in the Chiricahua mountains

Post by Deng09 »

canderson wrote:Hey Deng09, just catching up with these threads. Sorry for the late reply!

I've heard September is a great time to go! I've been once then and found the only Gila monster and lots of snakes. I think the best trip I've ever had was in July back in 1992; road cruising the flats was super productive. I think I found over 40 snakes that night representing 11 species as I recall. It was an awesome night I got to share with my friend Barney Tomberlin. Spring, although dry, can also be good in the mountains as snakes are getting active and before the heat comes on. May thru to the beginning of the monsoon can be extremely unproductive.

Have you gone on your trip yet? Would love to hear about it. I'll be heading that way soon!

Happy herping! :beer:
Thanks for all the tips everyone!! Haven't made the trip yet but I still plan on it. We are about a week away from the next new moon, and looks like lots of rains coming in the next week, so that might be a good opportunity if I can find the time. Otherwise maybe early September.
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