Rattlesnake Myths

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Texas Blonde
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Rattlesnake Myths

Post by Texas Blonde »

What are some pervasive rattlesnake myths y'all have run into? Like, being able to tell the age by the amount of rattles. I am doing a presentation on rattlesnake roundups, but am including a small education section. One of the things I would like to do is debunk some myths. But I thought it would also be funny to hear some of the things y'all have heard.

Weirdest I have heard: A rattlesnake will bite its tail, and chase you by rolling after you in a hoop.
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by ElliotH »

Ahhh yes, The hoop snake! They sure are dangerous! If they bite the wooden handle of a hoe it will swell large enough to build a barn with all the lumber!
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Don Becker
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by Don Becker »

I thought coachwhips were hoop snakes.
SirtalisSerendipity
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by SirtalisSerendipity »

I've heard that Mud Snakes were called "hoop snakes".
Crotalus
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by Crotalus »

If you cut a rattlesnake's head off, it won't die until sundown.
The fat and/or meat cures pretty much anything from acne to cancer.
The rattle hypnotizes prey.
erik loza
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by erik loza »

That the babies crawl into the mother's mouth for protection.

That it gets one button for every year of its life.

If it has a triangular head, it is a viper or rattlesnake.

They always rattle before they strike.

That the one he killed on his property was 7' long.
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Joseph S.
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by Joseph S. »

Rattlesnakes must coil and rattle prior to striking.

Rattlesnakes do not move more than 10 ft in their entire lives(comes from them tending to hang out in the same spots over and over again).

rattlesnakes love swimming and frequently bite bathers
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Bryan Hamilton
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by Bryan Hamilton »

If you freeze them solid they will come back to life when thawed.

Timber rattlesnakes live in the timber

every rattlesnake is a diamondback

they will charge you.

The Best:
I used to wear high top mocasins and I'd walk through the hills. The rattlers would bite my mocasins then I'd chop their head off with my bowie knife. I'd stick them in a bag and sell them to the indians for a nickel apeice. Some days I'd get over 200...
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jdustin
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by jdustin »

I've heard this one A TON. I've even heard a park ranger pass this gem along.
Baby rattlesnakes are the most dangerous. They haven't yet learned to control their venom.
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by bgorum »

One morning while photographing a gopher snake that was really going all out on the whole rattlesnake mimicry thing I had a lady slow down and stop her car. She warned me that I had better be careful because "they've been comin' out with those rattleless rattlesnakes lately". Dam "they" are always causing one problem or another!
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herpseeker1978
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by herpseeker1978 »

bullsnakes and rattlesnakes are hybridizing

rattlesnakes have learned that people kill them when they rattle, so they don't rattle to avoid being killed

my favorite: rattlesnakes bite people because they are trying to eat people!

Josh
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salamanderhunter
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by salamanderhunter »

DNR released a bunch of 'em to help control turkeys.
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Kent VanSooy
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by Kent VanSooy »

Got this one earlier this week! Rattlers apparently are learning not to rattle...

My fellow friends and family,

We have killed 57 rattlesnakes on two separate ranches this year. 24 @South bend & 33 @ Murray , Not one has buzzed! We provoked one fair sized boy with a stick and he coiled & struck at the stick a couple of times before he buzzed up and rattled. The purpose of this explanation is that I have been hearing the same from fellow ranchers and hunters in regards to the lack of warning with rattlesnakes.
I had lunch with a friend today and he offered a theory about the fact that these buggers aren't rattling anymore He raised pigs for years and reported that when he would hear a rattlesnake buzzing in the sow pen, the sows would bee line to it and fight over the snake. For the uninformed, pigs love to eat rattlesnakes.. Therefore, the theory is they are ceasing to rattle to avoid detection, since there are plenty of pigs roaming the countryside. I have a neighbor ranching lady who was bitten 3 weeks ago 2 times by the same snake without any warning....she spent 5 days in ICU, after 22 vials of anti-venom she is back at the ranch and still may lose her foot or worse yet her lower leg.
The days of perceived warning are over. Keep your boots on and use a light when out and about. As you all know, one can pop up just about anywhere! You may wish to forward this to anyone that would be interested.
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M Wolverton
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by M Wolverton »

jdustin wrote:I've heard this one A TON. I've even heard a park ranger pass this gem along.
Baby rattlesnakes are the most dangerous. They haven't yet learned to control their venom.
This is the most prevalent one I hear. Even though they are less likely to dry bite or meter small amounts.
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chris_mcmartin
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by chris_mcmartin »

http://www.mcmartinville.com/reptiles/info/folklore.htm

I haven't updated that page in quite a while, but there's a few on there that are rattlesnake-specific, and others that are more generic but which I've heard applied to rattlesnakes.
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kansascrote
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by kansascrote »

They taste good deep fried with chips!
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The Real Snake Man
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by The Real Snake Man »

erik loza wrote:That the one he killed on his property was 7' long.
"He" being the typical rancher. :lol:
kansascrote wrote:They taste good deep fried with chips!
Cheating! That's no myth. just kidding.
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Dan Krull
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by Dan Krull »

A rattlesnake bit someone in the boot and killed them. When the snake bit, it left its fangs in the boot. The boots were sold to a clothing shop after the funeral, and upon trying them on, the new owner was envenomated and promptly killed by the errant fangs.


Dan
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chris_mcmartin
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by chris_mcmartin »

Dan Krull wrote:the errant fangs
That's my band's name!
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Gyri
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by Gyri »

The best myth I have ever heard which is the most widespread is that rattlesnakes will attack without provocation. It's kind of ironic, one of the arguments for the rattlesnake roundups is that by killing the snakes you're saving human lives. Based on the bite stories I've heard, most bites occur as a direct result of someone attempting to handle, harass, or kill a rattlesnake. Bites from snakes the victim didn't know was there are rare indeed.

Also, you sort of can tell the age of a rattlesnake by the segments on the rattle, to a point. Timbers in VT shed, on average, 1.3 times per year and the first few segments increase in size. As long as there is at least 1 of those smaller segments on the rattle remaining you can extrapolate an approximate age based on the number of segments. Usually by about 10 sheds all the remaining segments are the same size and you're left guessing entirely.
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by Adam »

I was told by my step father and a couple others that the most deadly snake in the world is the red mojave rattlesnake. My step dad even gave me directions of were he has seen it LOL. I am still looking for it........

Whip snakes will chace you and whip you.

Milk snakes drink milk off cows.

And my friends dad swears there is tons of gilas near lake mathews ca.

(I know some are not rattlesnakes but still pretty funny)
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Dan Krull
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by Dan Krull »

chris_mcmartin wrote:
Dan Krull wrote:the errant fangs
That's my band's name!

I should know, I'm the lead singer!

DAN
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Jeremiah_Easter
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by Jeremiah_Easter »

Bryan Hamilton wrote:
they will charge you.
Watch out, this has actually happened to me while I was attempting to bag a speck for photos. :)
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reptilist
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by reptilist »

Here in eastern Arizona there are 30' long rattlesnakes that live underground. Geronimo used to have a pair that guarded his gold. When I first moved here I read the entire tale in a local newspaper... It was written as fact! About ten years ago a coworker told me the story... Fully believing it himself.
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Talusman
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by Talusman »

Hot chicks have no interest in rattlesnakes.
erik loza
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by erik loza »

Talusman wrote:Hot chicks have no interest in rattlesnakes.
Hahahahahaa....
Crotalus
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by Crotalus »

Jeremiah_Easter wrote:
Bryan Hamilton wrote:
they will charge you.
Watch out, this has actually happened to me while I was attempting to bag a speck for photos. :)

I agree, this one is occasionally true. I've been charged by a scute or two.
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Bryan Hamilton
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by Bryan Hamilton »

Crotalus wrote:Hamilton wrote:

they will charge you.




Watch out, this has actually happened to me while I was attempting to bag a speck for photos.



I agree, this one is occasionally true. I've been charged by a scute or two.
I just wish it would happen more often. It would make my dissertation so much easier.
Crotalus
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by Crotalus »

Bryan Hamilton wrote:
Crotalus wrote:Hamilton wrote:

they will charge you.




Watch out, this has actually happened to me while I was attempting to bag a speck for photos.



I agree, this one is occasionally true. I've been charged by a scute or two.
I just wish it would happen more often. It would make my dissertation so much easier.
I think scutes are the way to go, or maybe a grassland viridis. I rarely ever encounter scutes, so it probably happens with some frequency.
RobK

Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by RobK »

A friend of mine (who grew up in Mexico) said her mother and grandmother were terrified of "El Alicante". She, too, is extremely afraid of snakes.

El Alicante

"...A nocturnal hunter, the Alicante makes a sound like the whistle of a male construction worker issuing catcalls on 57th Street. This whistle comes in handy, for when the Alicante finds a target of its liking, it has been known to seduce women from the safety of her countryside homes, like a siren luring a sailor’s ship to certain death. And when women are recovering from the miracle of childbirth, the Alicante has been known to sneak into the new mother’s bedroom under cover of darkness, often while she is in a state of lactation and nursing her newborn child. The viper first hypnotizes the newborn with its rattle tail, eventually pacifying the child and placing the rattle in the kid’s mouth, keeping it entertained and quiet, as the asp sucks the milk out of the nursing mother’s breast."

http://www.lajerga.com/articles_issues/ ... cante.html
Crotalus
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by Crotalus »

Everywhere I've been "alicante" is Pituophis.
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by erik loza »

Crotalus wrote:Everywhere I've been "alicante" is Pituophis.
Ditto...

Coachwhip is "Chirrionera" and Crotalus is always "Cascabel" or "Vibora de Cascabel"
Crotalus
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by Crotalus »

Chirrionera is pretty much anything Masticophis-like.

Crotalus are cascabel, vibora, vibora de cascabel, vibora fina, vibora sorda, hocico de puerco (usually triseriatus complex and/or polystictus), hachita, cenizas (usually for leps/aquilus) , cenicitas (same as before), serrana...and then all the indians have their own set of words.
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by erik loza »

hocico de puerco

That is how the farmer whose pasture we were looking in, in Jalisco, referred to polystictus as.
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by kcmatt »

M Wolverton wrote:
jdustin wrote:I've heard this one A TON. I've even heard a park ranger pass this gem along.
Baby rattlesnakes are the most dangerous. They haven't yet learned to control their venom.
This is the most prevalent one I hear. Even though they are less likely to dry bite or meter small amounts.
Was going to comment on that one in similar fashion, Mike. It is not as far removed from reality as some like the hoop nonsense. Some of the myths actually have links to reality, then are spun out in rationale or proportion. The less accurate tangent to this statement is "Baby rattlesnakes have more concentrated (or more potent) venom."
Crotalus
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by Crotalus »

kcmatt wrote: "Baby rattlesnakes have more concentrated (or more potent) venom."
Naw, that can be true too. Babies in a few species have been found to have different venom compositions designed to do different things than adult venom (i.e. stop prey dead instead vs digest)
-JJ
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Cannon
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by Cannon »

M Wolverton wrote:
jdustin wrote:I've heard this one A TON. I've even heard a park ranger pass this gem along.
Baby rattlesnakes are the most dangerous. They haven't yet learned to control their venom.
This is the most prevalent one I hear. Even though they are less likely to dry bite or meter small amounts.
I totally thought this was true. DOH! I guess I learned something. I thought that baby rattlers were more dangerous for two reasons: 1) no venom control and 2) their venom is a bit more potent b/c it hasn't been released yet.

Glad I read this thread. I've spread this rumor. :(
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jdustin
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by jdustin »

That myth is soooo pervasive. Klauber mentions it being documented as far back as 1868 in a book by Naphegyi.
Speaking about venom yield Klauber also said, "It would probably be fair to assume that a baby rattler has from one-twentieth to one one-hundredth of the venom of an adult..." Rattlesnakes, pg 813.

Now, as for the idea that venom in the neos of some species may be more toxic than adults, that may be true. however, I do not think it warrants the blanket myth that "babies are more dangerous". With adults packing such a larger dose than neos, the venom would have to be A LOT more toxic to make babies worse.

There are also all the non technical things to take into consideration when deciding which one is "more dangerous". A big snake can reach further and longer fangs would probably mean deeper penetration. But babies are also harder to spot, and one might get too close easier.
Anyways, just my 2 cents. Cool thread.
M Wolverton wrote:
jdustin wrote:
I've heard this one A TON. I've even heard a park ranger pass this gem along.
Baby rattlesnakes are the most dangerous. They haven't yet learned to control their venom.
This is the most prevalent one I hear. Even though they are less likely to dry bite or meter small amounts.
I totally thought this was true. DOH! I guess I learned something. I thought that baby rattlers were more dangerous for two reasons: 1) no venom control and 2) their venom is a bit more potent b/c it hasn't been released yet.

Glad I read this thread. I've spread this rumor. :(
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Dan Krull
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by Dan Krull »

I too have been charged by a rattlesnake. An atrox. I was rather surprised. Came forward striking and crawling for me. It is worth mentioning that it was only AFTER I had walked up on it, and used my hook to disturb it. I don't think they will attack unless provoked.

Dan

PS. I have found far fewer scutes than atrox and have found them to be more placid. Just my personal experience. It may have to do with where I'm hunting.
AlanER
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by AlanER »

Here is a classic myth in Florida:
Cotton mouths protect their young and have life mates. Both the male and female will attack you and chase you for hours to protect their young or their territory.

Another myth I've heard:
Where there is one rattlesnake, its mate is always waiting. Always
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kansascrote
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by kansascrote »

Now, as for the idea that venom in the neos of some species may be more toxic than adults, that may be true. however, I do not think it warrants the blanket myth that "babies are more dangerous". With adults packing such a larger dose than neos, the venom would have to be A LOT more toxic to make babies worse.
C. simus comes to mind! Young simus are born hotter than heck and I have never understood WHY. But this is the only example I know.
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kcmatt
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by kcmatt »

Naw, that can be true too. Babies in a few species have been found to have different venom compositions designed to do different things than adult venom (i.e. stop prey dead instead vs digest)
-JJ
I remember reading that of Bothrops asper (a study at the same time showed no difference in nummifer age classes), and something on composition (more neurotoxins I think) in some crotes, but not as a concentration difference making juvie rattlesnakes more net dangerous than adults. Main point of my post on this myth is that I do think some herpers have a bit of a counter-myth on the juvenile toxicity and "danger" by inaccurately countering 180 degrees. They are not necessarily proportionately less dangerous, though as jdustin mentioned sheer quantity, and even things like fang size and weight/pressure behind a strike, would often outweigh many possible differences beyond dry or near dry bite potential.

Each bite by each individual is its own wonderful surprise.
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M Wolverton
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by M Wolverton »

Cannon wrote:
M Wolverton wrote:
jdustin wrote:I've heard this one A TON. I've even heard a park ranger pass this gem along.
Baby rattlesnakes are the most dangerous. They haven't yet learned to control their venom.
This is the most prevalent one I hear. Even though they are less likely to dry bite or meter small amounts.
I totally thought this was true. DOH! I guess I learned something. I thought that baby rattlers were more dangerous for two reasons: 1) no venom control and 2) their venom is a bit more potent b/c it hasn't been released yet.

Glad I read this thread. I've spread this rumor. :(
I have not read the original studies so I can't be sure, but I'd guess that the media reporting on them probably had a lot to do with starting this myth. Young snakes have been demonstrated to be less likely to control doses, and some do have different venom composition. These things were just never put into perspective and compared to what a large adult of the same species is capable of either extrapolating based on toxicity and potentially much larger yields or with actual cases.
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azatrox
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by azatrox »

Myth: the young are more dangerous than the adults.

While venom composition DOES change as the snake matures (likely due at least in part to the shift from reptilian prey to mammalian prey as the snake matures in some species) the young simply do not have the yield that an adult does...As such, a "full" envenomation from an adult is much more dangerous than from a neonate/juvenile.

-Kris
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kansascrote
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by kansascrote »

I agree with what is being said in the fact that an adult rattlesnake is much more capable of delivering a severe or fatal bite. However in some subspecies such as C. simus the young neonates produce a venom that contains the constituent crotoxin. This constituent produces neurotoxin symptoms which turn even a small neonate bite into a very serious matter. In contrast the adult C. simus bites are more of a hemostatic nature. In this one subspecies it is the difference between being hit by a VW bug at 100 MPH or run over by an 18 wheeler at 15 MPH. It all sounds good on paper but has very little to do with the myth.
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by Crotalus »

From:
Mackessy, S.P. (1988) Venum ontogeny in the Pacific rattlesnakes Crotolus viridus helleri and C.V. oreganus. Copeia, 1: 92-101.

"Venom from adult Pacific rattlesnakes is less toxic but has high protease activity, aiding in the digestion of prey in a thermally variable environment."

I agree with the discussion above though, if I had to pick something to bite me, it'd definitely be a baby instead of an adult...of any species...because if you lose the odds game with an adult, you're hurting - with a baby, you're doing alright.

-JJ
erik loza
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by erik loza »

Just remembered this one: Rattlesnakes will not cross a rope laid on the ground.

Not sure if it was already mentioned.
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chris_mcmartin
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by chris_mcmartin »

erik loza wrote:Just remembered this one: Rattlesnakes will not cross a rope laid on the ground.

Not sure if it was already mentioned.
I think that one was in my link. But don't bother me to check my own web page. :lol:

Just make sure it's a HORSEHAIR rope for maximum effect.
erik loza
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by erik loza »

Yes, must be horsehair.

I think there is one about "if you kill its mate, it will come for you", or something like that.
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KingCam
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Re: Rattlesnake Myths

Post by KingCam »

jdustin wrote:I've heard this one A TON. I've even heard a park ranger pass this gem along.
Baby rattlesnakes are the most dangerous. They haven't yet learned to control their venom.
I'm gonna come clean. I thought that was true :oops: I guess I've been spreading a bit of misinformation :o I was told by someone I trust about this kind of stuff that juveniles don't possess the muscle control over their venom glands/sacks required to inject portioned doses.
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