Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

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Don Cascabel
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Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by Don Cascabel »

This question came up in yesterday's post. Apparently, now would be the time to start one... so I ask, is anyone interested in putting one together? Please let me know by replying to this post. Requisites for your vote to count are as follows:

1. You live in Mexico and are a herper.
2. You don't live in Mexico, but herp there at least twice a year AND contribute to this forum, or would do so if there were a Mx. Chapter.

If you don't fall into those two categories... please refrain from voting... I know a lot of you would like to see more Mx stuff... but we really need relevant contributors because I sure as hell am not going to do it by myself.

Please realize the Chapter would be conducted in Spanish, with the hope of attracting more local participants, since that IS the language we use around here :)

Cheers,

Don Cascabel
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Jeff Lemm
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by Jeff Lemm »

Great idea since it didn't work out so great before. WIth the networks you guys have down there, it would be really great. I would contribute for sure.
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Fieldnotes
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by Fieldnotes »

:thumb:
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Mike VanValen
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by Mike VanValen »

Double :thumb:
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justinm
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by justinm »

I would love to see it, can't contribute much and my Spanish is pretty horrible these days. But I would surely like to see the veil lifted.
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Mike Rochford
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by Mike Rochford »

I find this a little surprising but I think it would be cool. I'll be down more than once this year and will contribute. The best part about this is I won't have a gringo accent since we are just typing! The real question is not whether people will contribute but rather to what extent. But even the "boring" stuff is pretty fascinating and if you are talking about stejis and webbi then this would certainly be a chapter forum worth clicking on.

Mike
Jackson Shedd
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by Jackson Shedd »

Absolutely, and hopefully people would post. I don't make it to MX twice a year, but I'm voting here anyway. Been a while since I've seen a MX herp post!
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Don Cascabel
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by Don Cascabel »

Does someone have a description of what the hell NAFHA is and its purpose so I can translate it and try to get some Mexicans involved??? Again, everyone's interest is appreciated but none of you are really relevant.

Cheers,

Don Cascabel
Redman
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by Redman »

Que tal Don Cascabel, estoy interesado en participar, me parece buena idea.
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by justinm »

I hope this works out I understood Redman's post with no effort and feel confident others can understand Spanish much better than they speak it like me.
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by hellihooks »

Here ya go Don,
This article will stay the same in the new bylaws rewrite, and I put the 'mission statement' in bold.

ARTICLE II. PURPOSE
The purpose of the association will be:

To collect scientific data on wild reptiles and amphibians in the United States, Canada, and Mexico and maintain a database for the collection and sharing of such scientific data.

To unite amateur/private herpetologists and professional herpetologists in the collection of data with the goal of conserving North American herpetofauna, with a greater goal of species management. A highlight of this group is to provide state or provincial and national game agencies with sufficient data to assist in the development of more educated decisions on how to better manage reptile and amphibian populations. The NAFHA and its members recognize that habitat destruction and alteration, poor land management, and non-native species are the greatest threats to North American herpetofauna. The NAFHA and its members will focus on methods of conservation related to the above issues and will assist in the collection of data in an effort to develop a management plan for such issues.

To disseminate the data collected, and otherwise make such data available, to recognized researchers, agencies, institutions, lawmakers, and others interested in herpetology and conservation for the purposes of education, conservation, research, and sustainable use of North American herpetofauna.

To promote knowledge in the general field of herpetology for the benefit of the public and the general NAFHA membership.
To inspire all people to enjoy and protect wild herpetofauna and promote the responsible enjoyment of the activity of observing herpetofauna in the wild.

* NOTE: We recognize the right of members and non-members of NAFHA to collect species of amphibians and reptiles in accordance with applicable local, state/provincial, and federal regulations. NAFHA, however, does not promote the collection of amphibians and reptiles and this practice will not be permitted at NAFHA-sponsored events. Exceptions may be considered in certain cases, e.g., discoveries of new taxa or range extensions.

If you want to see the proposed changes to the bylaws, go to the Nafha Main Board, under "Current Edits to Bylaws"... most of those items will be enacted upon voter approval, but a few will not take effect untill 2012.

Basically, we hope to build the database until it is the 'resource of choice' for all agencies requiring data, thus gaining us influence in the formation and/or alteration of herp managment/law. I don't know if its a problem in Mexico, but here in the states, we have some very poorly-concieved herp laws.... :roll: jim
Ivan Ahumada
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by Ivan Ahumada »

Don Cascabel wrote:Does someone have a description of what the hell NAFHA is and its purpose so I can translate it and try to get some Mexicans involved??? Again, everyone's interest is appreciated but none of you are really relevant.

Cheers,

Don Cascabel


Es de las mejores ideas :thumb: Yo apoyo en lo que pueda.

saludos.
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Dusty Rhoads
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by Dusty Rhoads »

Don Cascabel wrote:2. You don't live in Mexico, but herp there at least twice a year AND contribute to this forum, or would do so if there were a Mx. Chapter.

Please realize the Chapter would be conducted in Spanish, with the hope of attracting more local participants, since that IS the language we use around here :)

Creo que a mi me pertenece el #2 arriba. Espero que yo estare haciendo mi investigación científica/herpetologica alla este año (y en los años siguientes). Ayudare adonde y en cualquier capacidad como puedo.

Vivia en Chile por dos años, así que seria una buena oportunidad practicar y mantener mi castellano con los "herpers" ;) , -- pero mas importante -- a desarrollar y establecer contactos con herpers de Mexico.
Crotalus
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by Crotalus »

This is a better platform than the existing mexican forums. If Don/Scott could setup a language preference, we could probably get it rolling without much of an effort.

JJ
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by Steve Bledsoe »

Don,
Since you seem to not know much about NAFHA and what it's goals are, I'm curious to know why you want to form a NAFHA Chapter. Do you contribute data to the HERP database? Do you want to contrubute data to the HERP database? Do you know other Mexican herpers who would like to do the same?

Or is your interest in creating a Mexican FHF?

As I said, I'm just curious.
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by hellihooks »

Yeah... I think there might be a little confusion as to the difference between FHF and the Nafha Chapter forums. NAFHA is cheifly a data-collecting organization, with the goal of having as many members as we can, contribute as much data as they can to the database, so that we can accomplish our long-term goals of better herp mamagement.
The Chapter forums are chiefly for Chapter affairs, including Elections, voting, planning surveys/outings/educational programs, ect and herp-related discussions and FINALLY... field reports and general membership camaraderie/fellowship.

Here is the article on Membership:
ARTICLE III. MEMBERSHIP
Membership in the association is open to all persons 18 years of age or older who properly register, and accept and comply with these bylaws of the NAFHA, as such bylaws may be amended from time to time.

A chapter will be eligible for membership as a whole once it has a membership consisting of at least 5 NAFHA members and it completes registration at the NAFHA website. If a region does not have enough members to form its own chapter, members may nonetheless engage in the authorized activities of any other chapter.
Members of any chapter may participate in the authorized activities of any other chapter.

Chapters must collect and submit their own data to the NAFHA database on a timely and regular basis. If a chapter does not submit data in accordance with the above, a vote pursuant to Article VIIA may result in removal of such chapter.

Members acknowledge that membership and participation in NAFHA is done on a completely voluntary basis. Members further acknowledge that herping, the collection of data as contemplated herein, and other related activities may involve some risk and/or inherent danger. By joining NAFHA and engaging in the activities of the association and/or regional chapters, members assume all risks associated with the activities in which they are participating.

By submitting data and photos, members recognize that all data and photos could become completely public.



This is from the current bylaws... If you want to see what will be expected of members/Chapters in the near future, go to the Nafha Main Forum and see "Current Edit to Bylaws'... :D

Speaking on behalf of Nafha, we would LOVE to see a lot of data from south of the border begin to show up in the database, and We'd like to eventually see as many chapters down there, as up here... But there's alot more to being a chapter than just having a forum... :thumb:
Jim Bass, So Cal Ed Spec.

PS... seeing some of you guys registering and start entering data would go a long ways towards making this a mutually beneficial collaboration.
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Don Cascabel
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by Don Cascabel »

The idea is to get Mexican contributors to enter data in the NAFHA database for their own benefit. The forum would be a perk...

The whole reason Mexican states and species are even in the NAFHA list was our doing (myself, JJ and Psyon)... just a heads up in case you don't remember. We never participated, mainly due to lack of time, and the fact that we would be the only ones entering data for this country anyway. My current idea is to get other local herpers involved (and yes, I do have the contacts, just not sure if the motivation is there...)

Cheers,

Don Cascabel
Crotalus
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by Crotalus »

A mexican chapter forum to encourage participation in the HERP project seems like the perfect way to operate? Lets not pretend this is a big ordeal.


-JJ
chad ks
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by chad ks »

Personally I think this is an opportunity to discuss what it means to spread NAFHA internationally. It doesn't seem like "chapter" adequately covers it. There needs to be a national president with sub-chapters if you ask me.

It seems like between you two there'd be a lot of herper contact that could seriously grow down there with the right leadership and effort.
chad ks
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by chad ks »

hellihooks wrote:Yeah... I think there might be a little confusion as to the difference between FHF and the Nafha Chapter forums. NAFHA is cheifly a data-collecting organization, with the goal of having as many members as we can, contribute as much data as they can to the database, so that we can accomplish our long-term goals of better herp mamagement.
The Chapter forums are chiefly for Chapter affairs, including Elections, voting, planning surveys/outings/educational programs, ect and herp-related discussions and FINALLY... field reports and general membership camaraderie/fellowship.

Here is the article on Membership:
ARTICLE III. MEMBERSHIP
Membership in the association is open to all persons 18 years of age or older who properly register, and accept and comply with these bylaws of the NAFHA, as such bylaws may be amended from time to time.

A chapter will be eligible for membership as a whole once it has a membership consisting of at least 5 NAFHA members and it completes registration at the NAFHA website. If a region does not have enough members to form its own chapter, members may nonetheless engage in the authorized activities of any other chapter.
Members of any chapter may participate in the authorized activities of any other chapter.

Chapters must collect and submit their own data to the NAFHA database on a timely and regular basis. If a chapter does not submit data in accordance with the above, a vote pursuant to Article VIIA may result in removal of such chapter.

Members acknowledge that membership and participation in NAFHA is done on a completely voluntary basis. Members further acknowledge that herping, the collection of data as contemplated herein, and other related activities may involve some risk and/or inherent danger. By joining NAFHA and engaging in the activities of the association and/or regional chapters, members assume all risks associated with the activities in which they are participating.

By submitting data and photos, members recognize that all data and photos could become completely public.



This is from the current bylaws... If you want to see what will be expected of members/Chapters in the near future, go to the Nafha Main Forum and see "Current Edit to Bylaws'... :D

Speaking on behalf of Nafha, we would LOVE to see a lot of data from south of the border begin to show up in the database, and We'd like to eventually see as many chapters down there, as up here... But there's alot more to being a chapter than just having a forum... :thumb:
Jim Bass, So Cal Ed Spec.

PS... seeing some of you guys registering and start entering data would go a long ways towards making this a mutually beneficial collaboration.
What's with your PS? They can open up a chapter if they want to, it has nothing to do with persuading anyone if you ask me Jim.

Who cares if Don is an expert on the bylaws as of now Steve, it's just a post meant to brainstorm. As far as I'm concerned there are many people involved in NAFHA who haven no clue what it's really about, so let's not start that conversation unless we're ready to get down to business.
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justinm
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by justinm »

I want to see it grow. NAFHA is North America so this of course includes Mexico, I can't believe it's taken us this long to come up with such a good idea (to create a Mexican group). I'm looking forward to more posts from that region. To be xenophobic and try to ostracize anyone, should be quashed right now. We're all kindred spirits, let's remember that. Try to keep in mind that this is a hobby, and by being overzealous you risk running the casual hobbyist off. Let's keep this on the level and have some camaraderie here guys!
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by hellihooks »

My only point is... this is not a FHF matter, although starting here was a good idea, because FHF gets the most views. We're talking bout starting a Nafha chapter... entirely different entity than FHF...
This thread should technically be on the Nafha Main board... but again... who goes there? :roll: :D :D jim
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Fundad
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by Fundad »

I think its a GREAT idea, if the interest is there and commitment is there..

Why would anyone NOT want this?

Fundad

PS I would join the memebership of that chapter as I am planning on doing more Mexico, and entering every UTA I find :lol: :lol:
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by FunkyRes »

Fundad wrote:I think its a GREAT idea, if the interest is there and commitment is there..

Why would anyone NOT want this?

Fundad

PS I would join the memebership of that chapter as I am planning on doing more Mexico, and entering every UTA I find :lol: :lol:
Nah - head for Baja and find a remnant R boylii population. That would get you both a county record AND a country record.
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Don Cascabel
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by Don Cascabel »

Boyli was supposedly recorded from the Martir no? Just never verified??? I think that the Martir could easily host a population of something like that, however, what's weird, is that there are absolutely no records, not even historic, from Orange, San Diego and Riverside Cos. Or am I wrong???

Don Cascabel
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Don Cascabel
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by Don Cascabel »

A Mexico Chapter would be enough for now... I think we are still about 10 years away from having state chapters... if Fororeptiles is any suggestions, at this point they would be more embarrassing then anything else.

Cheers,

Don Cascabel
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Don Cascabel
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by Don Cascabel »

That being said... we have come a long way over the last 6 years, and some of the information/ publications being shared / discussed on one section of Fororeptiles surpases what I have seen on this website... Unfortunately that may be a product of the fact that many herp students down here can't get their hands on scientific lit except for via a herp forum.

Cheers,

Don Cascabel
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by hellihooks »

That was very interesting, going to Fororeptiles. made my way all the way to a locality rosy post before my computer froze, so didn't get to see any pics... :(

"Boyli was supposedly recorded from the Martir no? Just never verified??? I think that the Martir could easily host a population of something like that, however, what's weird, is that there are absolutely no records, not even historic, from Orange, San Diego and Riverside Cos. Or am I wrong???"

Who cares... IT's A FROG... JOKE!!! seriously... the above statement is exactly the kind of stuff I would look forward to seeing in a Mx. Chapter forum... :thumb: jim
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by Gary N »

Don Cascabel wrote:Boyli was supposedly recorded from the Martir no? Just never verified??? I think that the Martir could easily host a population of something like that, however, what's weird, is that there are absolutely no records, not even historic, from Orange, San Diego and Riverside Cos. Or am I wrong???

Don Cascabel

I've never seen the Martir record, but there are a few museum records of R. boylii from San Diego County - an undated one from "Jacumba, Boulder Park, and another from 3 mi. NNE Banner 2600 ft. 1965. They might be mistakes since the only other records are LA and San Bernardino counties, but you never know...
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jonathan
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by jonathan »

I think Don Cascabel had the exact right idea - this is a NAFHA matter, but FHF is the place to start this thread because it's where most people look, especially Mexican herpers who don't have their own chapter in NAFHA yet. And a Mexican subforum on NAFHA would be the first big step towards getting more data in the NAFHA database.

Steve/Jim were probably just misunderstanding a little due to the fact that it was on the FHF and the initial question about NAFHA's purpose.

I have 50+ Mexican entries in the naherp.com database (mostly from near both borders/touristy areas), but I probably won't get many more. Still, I've been hoping for this for a long time and wish them a lot of luck.

Following the bylaws, the proper procedure would be to garner enough interest in terms of members and people willing to run as officers, make sure that everyone understands the responsibilities of members and officers, and then start a chapter (not a whole new organization). If participation is eventually large enough that more chapters are warranted, they could split off and form their own chapters according to the bylaws. If that process was growing strongly (say, at least three chapters with strong participation), then I think that would be the time to think about whether we needed a president for the Mexican region and a whole new organizational structure.
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jonathan
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by jonathan »

Here is the process for creating a new chapter, soon TBA in the bylaws. To summarize, the steps would be as follows:

1) Don Cascabel and anyone else interested needs to contact the NAFHA board of directors and tell them who is willing to take responsibility so that the IBD can appoint a regional vice president, conservation officer, and education officer for Mexico.

2) Anyone interested in being an active member of NAFHA in Mexico should sign up on the database and submit a record (or a hundred records, if they would like).

3) Once those three officers showed they were willing to hold their positions for six months and 10 active NAFHA members said they were willing to be part of the new Mexican chapter, a petition to form a new chapter would be sent to the IBD.

4) Once the petition was approved, official elections for the 5 officer positions would be held and the Mexico Chapter of NAFHA would be created.


The official language, with the unrelated stuff cut out:
A. NAFHA Chapters may be formed to represent different regions of North America, such as a group of states or provinces, individual states or provinces, or parts of individual states or provinces. New chapters may be formed from states and provinces that are not presently included in an existing chapter....

B. Chapters shall be managed by an elected Chapter Board of Directors consisting of a President, Vice President, Secretary, Conservation Officer and Education Officer. The Chapter Board of Directors may also appoint regional Vice Presidents, Conservation Specialists and Education Specialists to represent the Chapter in specific geographical areas within the chapter that require official representation to conduct educational programs, field surveys, organized field outings and other official NAFHA functions.

C. A new Chapter may be formed from a .... geographically distinct region not already included within an existing Chapter by meeting the following criteria:

1. The region must have a sufficient membership base of a minimum of 10 Active Members.

3. If the region is not part of an existing Chapter, the region must have had an appointed regional Conservation Specialist, regional Education Specialist, and regional Vice President, appointed by the International Board of Directors, for a period of a minimum of 6 months.

4. The Active Members desiring to create the new chapter must petition the International Board of Directors with the request to form the new Chapter. The petition must include a list of the names of the petitioners, a description of the geographical region the new Chapter wishes to represent, and a proposed name for the new Chapter.

D. Petitions to form new chapters shall be reviewed by the International Board of Directors. The review period shall run for a period of 14 days from the date of the receipt of the petition. The decision to accept or reject the petition shall be decided by a majority vote of the members of the International Board of Directors in a poll that will run for a period of 7 days following the petition review.

E. Upon approval by the International Board of Directors of a petition to form a new chapter, the members of the new chapter may begin the process of nominating and electing Chapter Officers pursuant ARTICLE V of these bylaws. Full Chapter status shall be granted and recognized upon completion of the election process.
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Re: Who would be interested in a Mexico Chapter of NAFHA?

Post by jonathan »

Or, you could just get five guys together to volunteer to be officers and get it started right away before the new bylaws are voted on. ;)
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