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 Post subject: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 9th, 2017, 2:35 pm 
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Ok, so...lol I currently have someone leaving multiple comments on my flickr page pointing out to me that, "this photo has no green... and this photo, look there, GREEN...and look here, what's that, green?" :lol: All over some comments I left on a facebook post that he posted of an Aberrant Blackbelly CA kingsnake from Yolo county. I told him, that there are Fluorescent CA kings in Yolo that look like they are glowing like a highlighter marker because of the contrast to the black bands (dark dark dark brown, but maybe black buy some odd reason of morphism). Insisting that I was just rambling idiotic nonsense, he deleted all my comments from his post. Once I noticed and asked him why the comments' "disappeared" we started debating weather or not the fluorescent Kings exist. I told him that there are black (dark) with banana yellow (color of the peel, not fruit) banded kingsnakes in Yolo county and that the Fluorescents Kings are black with light mint green bands that have a spot of banana yellow in each individual scale (with some variation of course). The mix of the yellow and green creates a highlighter marker illusion that appears to glow. I may be the first to ever find one... if someone else has, please respond! I also stated that there was light mint green coloring on both of the snakes pictured below, however it goes unnoticed, and that is the same shade of green that is on the Yolo county Fluorescents. I also mentioned that the same light green color is found on some variations of Great Basin Gopher Snakes. He is literally insisting that I am crazy with a mental issue...lol I am insisting that I have a sharper eye and more knowledge on the subject....

This reminded me of a Facebook post that was going around that a girl showed me at work... huge internet thing and was even on the news, I think. It was about a picture of a woman's dress, where some people saw it as a blue drees and others saw it as a white dress. Showing the difference between peoples visual color perception. So, I thought this would be fun to ask all of you, what do you see...? Is there any green on these snakes?




ImageSpeckled Banded Kingsnake by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageCalifornia Kingsnake by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 9th, 2017, 7:15 pm 
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From the pics I think I see early stage of pre-ecdysis.


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 Post subject: Or maybe its this
PostPosted: July 9th, 2017, 8:40 pm 
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https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2706478/


"It should also be noted that incoherent scattering can produce whiteness by scattering all visible wavelengths. For the purposes of this review, we interpret iridescence in it's broadest sense, meaning colors that change in hue or intensity with viewing geometry."


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 9th, 2017, 10:48 pm 
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Yeah, idk... I suppose that pre-ecdysis is possible. But, I'm not referring to the iridescence. Also one was only a year old and fresh out of shed. When I was holding these snakes in my hand, the value of the green didn't change according to the angle to the light. It stays the same color no matter how you angle the snake. I don't think anyone else is even gonna comment on this post, like the Spadefoot post, so I'll just add this pic now... I went into photoshop just to see for myself if I was wrong. I used the color dropper to sample the color and sure enough there is green in there. Like we all read on here, all the time, the photos don't do it justice. When holding the snakes, they look like a softer lighter version of the Andes mints color. This is damn near exact: https://www.bing.com/images/search?view ... tedIndex=0

They're beautiful snakes! ...and they do exist. They look like a highlighter



ImageScreenshot (83) by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 10th, 2017, 2:08 am 
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Porter I think I misunderstood what you meant...

The thing with you is, you look at a snakes pattern as deeply as a gemologist looks at the facet cuts and color values of a diamond and well, I find it refreshing.

I hope you liked the iridescent stuff anyway. I love that phenomenon in nature. Makes one wonder about beauty.


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 10th, 2017, 8:16 am 
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This is a tough question because as you said, color perception varies depending on who is looking. I personally don't really see any green in either of your photos, just a pale yellow.

Furthermore, I also know that cameras cannot reproduce color and light EXACTLY as it truly exists with any consistency between cameras. What's more, computer monitors vary quite a bit too. I use two monitors and the same picture has a completely different hue depending on which monitor I am displaying it on. So showing photos on the internet and using a color dropper in Photoshop, imo, really does nothing to prove anything about what color something actually is or isn't.

So for me personally, unless something is more apparent and so vivid that it really stands out even in an unedited photograph, then I don't really think it is worth arguing about too much. The only way to solve this would be in person with a group of folks who can see the animal under a varying set of natural light conditions and all vote on what they see. Otherwise, I feel we are just talking about a very narrow matter of opinion.

So in a nut shell, I am not saying you are crazy or making this up, I just saying it is damn near impossible to interpret delicate color variances with any accuracy via digital cameras and computer monitors.


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 10th, 2017, 9:51 am 
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Kelly Mc wrote:
Porter I think I misunderstood what you meant...

The thing with you is, you look at a snakes pattern as deeply as a gemologist looks at the facet cuts and color values of a diamond and well, I find it refreshing.

I hope you liked the iridescent stuff anyway. I love that phenomenon in nature. Makes one wonder about beauty.



I'm a very confusing person Lol no worries. Thanks for the response

Lol ...that's funny you say that. I actually just took a assessment test recently and one of the career suggestions was Gem & Diamond worker. I do pay closer attention to detail than the average person and I notice a lot of things that go under the radar that most people don't even think about. That reeeeeaally pisses a lot of people off, especially the guy I mentioned above and seems to always provoke a bitter hatred in certain types of people. Get's them frantically trying to come up with excuses to discredit the ability. I've dealt with it since childhood. One time a girl in 5th grade saw a portrait I did of Charles Bronson for my mom on a piece of cardboard and INSISTED that a traced it. Then continued to convince other kids in the class to back her up. I may never have seen a Fluorescent Kingsnake, but at least I can trace through cardboard. Woooo! Superman :lol: dunt, dunt, dunt, duhhhhh...... bastards. :?
Kinda sucks... :? that's why I really have no interest in learning all the scientific names or names of plants. I get enough hatred as it is. I would learn those things for the right woman tho. Building something different...ya know. Hopefully she's out there reading this...somewhere :roll:


Yeah, I've always loved iridescence. How can you not, right? I scanned through the read last night but, I'm gonna read right now after I post. I was way too drained at the time I read your response. I just finished the frog cartoon, so I'm gonna try to get that up in a minute here.


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 10th, 2017, 10:04 am 
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RenoBart wrote:
This is a tough question because as you said, color perception varies depending on who is looking. I personally don't really see any green in either of your photos, just a pale yellow.

Furthermore, I also know that cameras cannot reproduce color and light EXACTLY as it truly exists with any consistency between cameras. What's more, computer monitors vary quite a bit too. I use two monitors and the same picture has a completely different hue depending on which monitor I am displaying it on. So showing photos on the internet and using a color dropper in Photoshop, imo, really does nothing to prove anything about what color something actually is or isn't.

So for me personally, unless something is more apparent and so vivid that it really stands out even in an unedited photograph, then I don't really think it is worth arguing about too much. The only way to solve this would be in person with a group of folks who can see the animal under a varying set of natural light conditions and all vote on what they see. Otherwise, I feel we are just talking about a very narrow matter of opinion.

So in a nut shell, I am not saying you are crazy or making this up, I just saying it is damn near impossible to interpret delicate color variances with any accuracy via digital cameras and computer monitors.




I totally agree! There's no point to it and that's why I just posted the color dropper pic instead of giving any response time. Too many smart people here to debate something under such irrational circumstances. The guy who's pissed off over this snake will just have to accidently find one some day, then he'll know. In the kingsnake pic above, that one pronounced spot/blotch on the brown band scale DOES NOT show up in photoshop as green through the color dropper! However, it was that snake that I first noticed the green color on. Now , we all can see how black the head and other body parts look that are not being directly hit by the overcast sunlight. That's what causes the brown to show. So, I know that's why the green doesn't show up with the dropper. Also, that individual was a very deep banana yellow color, which isn't rare for the area, but somewhat rare to find with black bands. The banana color doesn't really show up either. But, I know there's experienced Yolo herpers who have seen those!

Ya know, as I thought more about this... I realized that it's a lot easier to associate that color with green because I saw it as green while holding it in my hand. So the memory of green stuck, even tho it is deluded in the pictures.


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 10th, 2017, 10:14 am 
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He's a shot of the same king under point n shoot flash. It still looks brown under the blown out parts from the flash, but in comparison to a brown and yellow king, you can see the deep banana yellow better and the darker black coloration. This was actually the first kingsnake I ever found or looked for in Yolo county while attempting a blackbelly lifer. I was so stoked to find it 8-) Never saw yellow on a black looking kingsnake before that. Only the black and white looking kings and brown and yellow kings from North Highlands/ Rio Linda area

ImageCalifornia Kingsnake by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 10th, 2017, 2:00 pm 
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If you can buy or borrow one of these, include it in the photo with the snake...that way, people can calibrate their monitors to show the true colors.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/contro ... sku=465286

I bought one to use in photographing "green" Crotalus lepidus, but I've yet to come across ANY lepidus, let alone a green one! :|


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 10th, 2017, 2:11 pm 
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Cool stuff :thumb: Thanks Chris!


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 10th, 2017, 10:28 pm 
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Porter: I was hoping to locate a different article, that I used to have in my older bookmarks, that I lost in deleting them when they were too many unfoldered to be useful for reference purposes.

The white luminescence on king scutes that appears stronger at certain angles yet vanishes in others I was kind of stuck on, while not a color play think is an artifact of same structural overlay.

Some other species have really splendid prismatic belly and head plate scales, even if the rest of them not so much.

But I get what you mean. Ive seen some milks that to me, the light portion of pattern looks absolutely silvery to my eye, with a minty touch.

Bummer what happened to you about the drawing. Yeah, when that frantic thing happens, especially in a team up, it usually means you are on to something good.


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 10th, 2017, 10:47 pm 
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In all honesty, stuff like that is hard reading for me. I don't really read that stuff... so the terminology is something I have to really stop and think about to understand completely what they are saying. A lot of the things you write is somewhat complicating for me as well... :lol: You talk like a scientific paper, which is cool! I just don't really read unless I have to. I've never enjoyed it and it gets boring. I read required books and stuff in high school and college, but the only thing I ever bought and read from beginning to end was probably Heavier Than Heaven. And I didn't finish the last chapter. I already knew the story like the back of my hand and it was just too hard to continue. I do thumb through things here and there...bits and pieces, but I'm more into visual media. However, I HATE TV Lol There's only a handful of shows and films that I can find of any real substance and value.

The story of the girl and the drawing is one in many...lol Preparation for the future. Everyone needs that at one time or another. I was always praised and held in deep respect by my friends for being able to draw. It outweighs the negative.


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 11th, 2017, 1:09 pm 
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Also, Kelly... I am in no way trying to discourage you or anyone else in posting useful and informative facts about any subject I happen to post! The readers out there are definitely not going to get this source of reference from me :lol: I feel like I've done my part and I'm always glad and welcome supportive and non-supportive evidence and info :thumb: Always appreciated :beer: Just want to make that clear to readers. No, ''I" in team...


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 11th, 2017, 2:32 pm 
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Porter beautiful Kingsnake. I see what you mean, the color does stand out brightly in contrast to it's base color, no question. As far as the color it looks somewhat green. That being said I'm colorblind so no doubt it's yellow, and very striking, it' pops.

Kelly, I see the iridescence like appearance in the belly and have seen that in a lot of colubrids but given the high gloss nature of this individual snake I don't believe it's ready to shed.


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 11th, 2017, 3:34 pm 
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rpecora wrote:
Porter beautiful Kingsnake. I see what you mean, the color does stand out brightly in contrast to it's base color, no question. As far as the color it looks somewhat green. That being said I'm colorblind so no doubt it's yellow, and very striking, it' pops.

Kelly, I see the iridescence like appearance in the belly and have seen that in a lot of colubrids but given the high gloss nature of this individual snake I don't believe it's ready to shed.


Thanks man! Kelly, he may be right about the gloss on the belly. Just about every getula I've seen, has that gloss (from what I can remember). It's common enough in my finds that I don't really pay attention to that aspect of it. Whether or not that's an indication of a shed coming on, I don't know... I haven't kept a kingsnake of any kind as a pet in close over 20 yrs. My ex-girlfriend kept a normal looking king back around 2010, but I didn't pay much attention to it and we didn't keep him for very long.

I just realized today that I've been denied access to my photobucket photos :oops: I waiting to hear back from support...anybody know what's going on with that? I own the copyrights, so how can they deny me access...?

Anyway. That was the first photo sharing site I ever used and still has my original photos. There were some pics of the kingsnake on there that I wanted to share. This is what I call a "Banana yellow and Black" CA king. The Fluorescent CA Kings, have bands of that light mint green color as a base color, with a small single dab of this banana yellow color, on each individual scale of the light mint colored bands.

Most of the color is still blown out by the glare, but the true color is in the shade...


ImageScreenshot (93) by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageScreenshot (92) by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageScreenshot (91) by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageScreenshot (90) by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 11th, 2017, 3:48 pm 
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These are Fluorescent kings... The first one has been saturated and darkened a little to get the natural look to actually show up. From my computer, the green on the plant looks accurate, but a little too dark. The adult below it also has the same coloration. However, the glow doesn't show up as good. Believe me, when you are holding these snakes, it's amazing... I've never seen anything like it. There is a special little spot I know of where both of these were found... However, I did not collect these snakes and I will NEVER reveal the location to ANYONE! So, don't ask... :lol: If you find one on your own. That's god's/mother natures test for you and you either pass or fail... your choice.

I don't even like showing off rare snakes like this. If you notice one thing about me... the more unique the animal looks, the less photos I have posted of it. Aside from the red gigas... that thing is too amazing not to post and the only one ever photographed that was that red. The only reason I posted my aberrant blackbelly kingsnake lifer is to set an example (with the video) of what to do when you find a snake like that... LET IT GO!


Imagefloscent black king by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageDelta Kingsnake by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageDelta Kingsnake by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageDelta Kingsnake by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 11th, 2017, 4:01 pm 
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This is a super light color blackbelly kingsnake. In hand it looks brown and white... however when darkened you can see there is a small dab of yellow in each scale of the white colored bands. The brown blotching on the belly shows the evidence of the blackbelly trait. This snake does NOT glow because it lacks the light mint green color! ...and I believe the contrast to the black coloration also plays a roll in the glowing illusion.

I also, found a banana color blackbelly kingsnake this year.... first I've seen. But, you guys will have to wait till the end of the year to see it :thumb:




ImageBlackbelly Kingsnake by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageBlackbelly Kingsnake by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageBlackbelly Kingsnake by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 11th, 2017, 4:08 pm 
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Same snake from cellphone pics:



Image20160505_101653 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

Image20160505_101713 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

Image20160505_101720 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr








Normal Blackbelly coloring through a cellphone. This snake actually looks more caramel brown in person. Like a normal Golden Brown Black-bellied King.


ImageGolden Brown Black Belly Kingsnake by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

Image0 Golden Brown Black Belly Kingsnake 1 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 11th, 2017, 4:35 pm 
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ImageScreenshot (94) by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 11th, 2017, 5:00 pm 
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Not really sure what Im tying to see with the green but that screen shot 92 is one of the coolest, manliest shots of a king ever.

I dont want to try scrolling back again, to the other pics but theres some pre shed opacity going on for sure in alot of those pictures.


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 11th, 2017, 5:27 pm 
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Haven't noticed in any animals I've kept in the past where the opacity isn't evenly distributed pre-shed dulling the overall appearance of the snake. Certainly none of it in the eyes, and no pre-shed wrinkles noted. Still you could be right.


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 11th, 2017, 5:34 pm 
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Kelly Mc wrote:
Not really sure what Im tying to see with the green but that screen shot 92 is one of the coolest, manliest shots of a king ever.


Artistic dynamic and dramatic angle play at it's finest! :thumb: I love that shot too. It's been years since I looked at it. Those shots are from 2010 I believe... away with the voucher angles and in with the art 8-) :beer:


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 11th, 2017, 5:54 pm 
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It's funny because all I could think about when I took those shots, were... These (certain people who didn't like me at the time) people are gonna fry me for posting a kingsnake in a tree like this :lol: Turns out those same people who were constantly trying to prove to everyone that I was a bad influence to field herping, are now popular as hell on facebook preaching the things I argued with them about back then :lol: blows my mind... literally like 500 people jumping on a band wagon opinion that wasn't cool when I said it and I was hated for it. Life is a trip....

But, yeah... I think this was around the time I started just doing things my own way and going a more artistic route instead of following the pack. I spent a good year of taking artistic voucher shots in hand during 2009- 2010ish, to figure out how to get the color to come out in my shots. Before that, I was all voucher-esque :lol: Then I started taking photos like I was drawing a picture. Looking for shape balance and such. A lot of my photos actually resemble old artwork I did back in high school and college.


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 11th, 2017, 6:09 pm 
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rpecora wrote:
Haven't noticed in any animals I've kept in the past where the opacity isn't evenly distributed pre-shed dulling the overall appearance of the snake. Certainly none of it in the eyes, and no pre-shed wrinkles noted. Still you could be right.


I have noticed it early on in the process, that the opacity is easier to see on the belly, probably because its simply larger surface to see than the eye, but i see eye opacity beginning in that big head shot, as well as an over all cast. Sometimes I also wonder if the eyes/brille creeps along in secretion process a little behind the rest of the skin, because of higher cellular lipid of the skin germinating layer.

But the snakes seem to notice it, even before it becomes dense enough to be obvious to me and before they go into complete hiding in full blue. But when it is early and faint they will be shyer, more defensive.

Chronology isnt always a solid indicator either, as a cut or a scrape will instigate a succession of sheds unconventionally close together.


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 11th, 2017, 6:26 pm 
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.


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 11th, 2017, 6:29 pm 
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Ok, since these pics are more of an importance to the post's subject... I'm just gonna post them now. These are the photos of the Banana yellow backbelly I found this year, untouched. Meaning I did not edit them, these are the original photo captures. I WILL fix these shots up at the end of the year, so that the color comes out authentic. These are dingy looking because I purposely shoot my shots dark in order to retain the color (a little trick I learned, taught myself). You can clearly see in comparison with the carmel colored brown cellphone shots of the Golden Brown Blackbelly kingsnake above, that this snake is a very rich color of yellow... Banana yellow 8-) Not sure how common these are, but this is the first I've found. I do know one thing... I'm gonna be called an idiot over this snake by Chad Lane as well, until he finds one himself and also finds his own "green" king.... then, he'll post it to facebook and be the coolest guy in the world :lol: lmfao

ImageDSC_0289 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageDSC_0323 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageDSC_0235 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageDSC_0227 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageDSC_0224 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 11th, 2017, 6:35 pm 
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Ok, here's one where I just hit the auto contrast once. Not a finished photo in my opinion...still too much contrast. However, look at the color of my hand. It's not tweeked. Yellow blackbelly :thumb:

ImageDSC_0227 a by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 11th, 2017, 6:42 pm 
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Those colors are still blown out by the sun, obviously... but even in its paleness, you can see it is black and yellow. I do want to point out to Kelly, this snake did have the white glossy glares we've been talking about, on the black checked portions of the belly! I angled this snake best I could in clear sky direct sun to capture the colors. About 40 shots were taken that had those little white belly glares, before/within these shots that I finally got right with no blur value. This little guy could have been getting close to shed tho...! He didn't look fresh out of shed with that crisp look. This snake was also RELEASED.


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 11th, 2017, 6:53 pm 
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So back to the green-ish-ism, the last pic i can finally see it I think, but its an odd yellow green, right?


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 11th, 2017, 7:09 pm 
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Hhaha...no, no green in the yellow blackbelly. Not visually in person anyway. I wouldnt be surprised if there were specks of mint in there, but this is just black and yellow to the eye. With a little toasted brown on top.

1) Banana & black king = Banana yellow + black (dark dark dark dark brown, according to Hubbs. Not a desert phase kingsnake) + sometimes some light mint speckling in some places, but not always

2) Banana & black blackbelly king = banana yellow + black (dark dark dark dark brown) + some brown toasted dorsal

3) Fluorescent king = Light mint green + black (dark dark dark dark brown) + banana yellow blotches/dabs within each light mint green colored scale


Where the hell is Hubbs...!? :lol: These are probably all already in his book with different names and I'm pissing him off just as much as Chad Lane :lol: :lol:

Hubbs, take over!


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 12th, 2017, 5:42 am 
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Kelly Mc wrote:
rpecora wrote:
Haven't noticed in any animals I've kept in the past where the opacity isn't evenly distributed pre-shed dulling the overall appearance of the snake. Certainly none of it in the eyes, and no pre-shed wrinkles noted. Still you could be right.


I have noticed it early on in the process, that the opacity is easier to see on the belly, probably because its simply larger surface to see than the eye, but i see eye opacity beginning in that big head shot, as well as an over all cast. Sometimes I also wonder if the eyes/brille creeps along in secretion process a little behind the rest of the skin, because of higher cellular lipid of the skin germinating layer.

But the snakes seem to notice it, even before it becomes dense enough to be obvious to me and before they go into complete hiding in full blue. But when it is early and faint they will be shyer, more defensive.

Chronology isnt always a solid indicator either, as a cut or a scrape will instigate a succession of sheds unconventionally close together.

I don't disagree with that. It appears when you originally stated pre-Ecdysis you were referring to the beginning of the process rather than the actual coming out of blue and ready to shed, which is what I would term pre-Ecdysis. I can take things a bit too literal.

Porter, those snakes have amazing color. Black and white are nice, but I like the brown and and yellow more. I have seen plenty of variation in the southland with some having that green hue, but nothing close to the "Glow" or brightness of the ones you've shared here. As I said before I'm colorblind so a lot of the time what I see as green is oftentimes yellow.

You stated that the last batch of photos are unedited, what about the pictures in your leading post?

What is a "Yellow Blackbelly"? Obviously a nickname, but you must have some reasoning for using it. Yellow and black belly, or derived as a phase of what you would normally see from that area assuming you would normally find Blackbelly Kings there? Just curious.


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 12th, 2017, 8:23 am 
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I wonder if Porter has a different ability to see colors - if a person can be color blind maybe the opposite is true.

When did you find out you were color blind?


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 12th, 2017, 1:04 pm 
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Kelly Mc wrote:
I wonder if Porter has a different ability to see colors - if a person can be color blind maybe the opposite is true.

When did you find out you were color blind?

When I was in the first or second grade. About four in a hundred people are colorblind, mostly males.


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 18th, 2017, 3:48 pm 
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Quote:
we started debating weather or not the fluorescent Kings exist.


Yeah that NEVER happened. LOL

Fantastic Kingsnake finds Mr. Porter!


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 18th, 2017, 5:05 pm 
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The colors you are seeing are all related to the lighting. The adults in your area are muted yellow and brown, and the young are lemon yellow and black. The Black-bellies (brown bellies, actually) are tan, pewter, or brownish with dark brown bands or base color...with young that are sometimes dirty yellowish. Period. :thumb: Snakes in bright sunlight will always look yellower...


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 19th, 2017, 1:48 pm 
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Chad M. Lane wrote:
Quote:
we started debating weather or not the fluorescent Kings exist.


Yeah that NEVER happened. LOL

Fantastic Kingsnake finds Mr. Porter!


Lol A DEBATE is and argument between two people about a certain topic. This topic being... whether or not Fluorescent looking CA kingsnakes exist, due to the color GREEN on Yolo county CA getula (also found on individuals in Sutter). Although I agree your tactics of debate were not, "formal" (deleting my comments about fluorescent Kings from your facebook post & adding all these "no green" comments to my photos below :lol: ) a debate still took place Lol


ImageScreenshot (144) by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageScreenshot (143) by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageScreenshot (142) by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageScreenshot (141) by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageScreenshot (140) by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageScreenshot (139) by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageScreenshot (138) by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageScreenshot (137) by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr



:lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 19th, 2017, 2:13 pm 
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Brian Hubbs wrote:
The colors you are seeing are all related to the lighting. The adults in your area are muted yellow and brown, and the young are lemon yellow and black. The Black-bellies (brown bellies, actually) are tan, pewter, or brownish with dark brown bands or base color...with young that are sometimes dirty yellowish. Period. :thumb: Snakes in bright sunlight will always look yellower...


Brian, I agree with what you wrote here, but I'm sorry... I have to disagree with the green color being a result of light. Unless we are talking about light in regards to have it make things blue. Blue birds, blue bellied lizards, Kingsnake eyes, ect... The SAME minty green is also found on Great Basin Gopher Snakes! On the skin between the scales. Not all, but some... and it gives them more of a vary faint greenish glow in appearance.

I also have to disagree with the, "The adults in your area are muted yellow and brown, and the young are lemon yellow and black." That as a universal truth, in regards to color changing with the age of the snake, is false! I'm not saying that doesn't happen!! But, the adult pictured above in the tree, is just as black looking as the little Fluorescent guy I found. It is NOT COMMON! This is why it had stood out to me :) ...Im very aware of the degrees of brown and yellow looking kings & black and white looking kings. What I am referring to as, banana yellow and black Kings & Fluorescent kings is something completely different. Not only that, but the first time I ever saw a brown and yellow kingsnake, was in Rio Linda and it was found the same day, same pile of scrap boords, with a black and white looking kingsnake. same size! Both just little babies with in a year old and I kept them BOTH as pets. Shedding never changed the difference between those snake!

I understand why you and Chad can't except this. It goes against your understanding of getula. I'm willing to hold on to the next one I find and have Chad drive down to examine the snake. I'm not sure how he will side, but I did call him to confirm the melanistic gartersnake I found as "melanistic" however, with this...personal feelings may get in the way, idk. I'll give him benefit of the doubt. So, next green king I see, I'll keep if you guys really want proof or I can photograph it in a way that is exceptable to you both...?

Maybe, Kelly's right... maybe my eyes are just more in tune to these kind of things. Perhaps drawing/sketching in fine detail has enhanced to ability. Where someone who draws stick figures (for example, not implying any art skills to you both) would not have the ability to see it...? idk. However, making your judgements from photographs is an unfair situation to begin with... you just got to see em, apparently.


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 19th, 2017, 2:25 pm 
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ImageGreat Basin Gopher Snake by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 19th, 2017, 2:36 pm 
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What color does my ensatina icon look to you guys? Yellow or green....because it's green. Now if you click on the lighter portions of it with the photoshop color dropper tool, it will look yellow to you, but look where the yellow is on the scoll bar... it's actually a very light green...Now, if you click on the outer rim/ shaded area where it starts to get darker, there is not debate...its green :mrgreen: the same thing with what Brian mentions about the yellow looking more yellow in bright lighting. Which is why I'm beginning to understand how this got overlooked for so long IF it's not a newer variation of kingsnake coloring...peace guys. I'm gonna be gone for awhile


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 19th, 2017, 2:39 pm 
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Also, check the great basin with the color dropper... plenty of green in there guys :mrgreen: :)


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 19th, 2017, 4:18 pm 
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for reference... for people who don't have experience with CA kings or limited knowledge. These individuals are black and white looking CA kingsnakes. The adult hanging in the tree is just as black IF NOT MORE black looking than these. I'm telling ya man, when I flipped that adult kingsnake that is photographed in the tree, it BLEW MY FUCKIN MIND... I never saw a black and yellow kingsnake in my life before that and that snake was BLACK and BANANA YELLOW... I'm mean, so frickin yellow I couldn't believe me eyes.

Now there are only a few green speckles sprinkled about that individual hanging in the tree! The base color of the yellow bands DID NOT LOOK GREEN at all. Just super enriched yellow. These two white and black loking kings pictured below HAVE NO GREEN on them. One is an adult and one is a sub-adult, I guess. a couple years old probably.It's only certain individuals in yolo and sutter county that I've found the banana yellow and/or mint green...ok, that should be less confusing lol


ImageCalifornia Kingsnake by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageCalifornia Kingsnake by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 19th, 2017, 5:08 pm 
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Uh...look again...the snake in the tree is dark brown. I can see it perfectly well...in shade they will look darker, but in the sun you can see the brown. You took the pic on a cloudy day, so it's tough to see the brown, but it's there...there are no black adults in your area...sorry...

The 2nd to last one you posted is dark brown too...

Image

these are not black scales... :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 19th, 2017, 6:19 pm 
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Siiiiigggghhhhhh.... :roll: fine I give up :lol: the problem with you and Chad is neither one of you take the time to even read my words. I would quote myself from the comment post above your comment post, but anybody can look there, including yourself Brian, LOL and read very clearly that I stated that the two pictured below are black and white looking snakes....black and white "looking" as in they look black and white LOL the other snakes that have yellow are brown and they do not look black at all they look brown and yellow. And the black bellied snakes usually always look Brown and brownish caramel color to how I would describe it. The black bellies do not look yellow they look Brown and kind of a caramel ish brown color for the lighter colored bands... This is why I'm saying that the little black belly being held in my hand is a yellow and black black belly because it's not carmel brown like normal black bellies.

I expect this from Chad but Brian you have no excuse... LOL seriously I get Chad telling me all the time that he thinks I'm a lunatic because I've misread or Misjudged his words or someone else's words in some way and he thinks I'm crazy all the time... LOL but what he needs to do is get himself a copy of an interpersonal Communications College textbook and he needs to grasp the understanding of "context clues" because if he is not intending to send out the messages he sends with his context clues then he needs to pick his words more carefully and read others more clearly as well... It always leaves me in the position where I think he really is sending out the message he's trying to convey but then he denies it. Lol And him thinking I'm crazy is just because he doesn't understand completely what I understand....i.e. if you are shooting a game of pool, Billiards, I might not take in that straight shot on the three ball in the corner and instead I'll go ahead and Bank it so that it sets me up for the four, then five, and then I can get down towards the end of the table for the position on the six and seven and then the combo on the nine... But Chad's not thinking that far ahead so he thinks I'm a lunatic for not taking the straight shot in the corner LOL

Really I think the two of you are just f****** with my head and I'm done talking to the both of you :lol: :lol: :lol: both of you are jelly and you need to step up your game instead of trying so hard to destroy mine 8-) :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 19th, 2017, 7:01 pm 
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This whole thread is pretty entertaining. :)


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 19th, 2017, 7:36 pm 
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That's what we're hear for Mr. Bart :thumb:

:lol: :lol: :lol:

..that's not the way you spell here, but you didn't hear it from me...


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 19th, 2017, 7:51 pm 
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I said the "debate" on fluorescent Kings never existed, because well it NEVER happened.

The debate and more so point fun, was about green, which is in fact a photogenic artifact. I only read your first reply, since YOU can't read. ;)


Again beautiful kings man!


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 19th, 2017, 9:11 pm 
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Well, I believe you. lol I saw a juvenile that had a light greenish hue to his yellow bands, so I do believe that greenish color does exist. My friend says his juvenile Pink Pearl (lavender X Palomar ghost double homozygous) Cal kings have a lot of that light green in them. I think its visible outside, but may not show up inside. And in most specimens it probably goes away with age. If you've found a population with older adults having that green, that would be pretty cool to see.


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 19th, 2017, 9:16 pm 
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Ross Padilla wrote:
Well, I believe you. lol I saw a juvenile that had a light greenish hue to his yellow bands, so I do believe that greenish color does exist. My friend says his juvenile Pink Pearl (lavender X Palomar ghost double homozygous) Cal kings have a lot of that light green in them. I think its visible outside, but may not show up inside. And in most specimens it probably goes away with age. If you've found a population with older adults having that green, that would be pretty cool to see.


FUGGIN ROSS MUTHA FUGGIN PADILLA!!!!! WOOOOOOOO! BAM BAM POW! Bing Bing Bang!! :thumb: :thumb: :thumb: :beer: :beer: :beer:

sleepy time now for the porter :sleep: :sleep: :sleep: :sleep:
:lol: :thumb:


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 Post subject: Re: Fluorescent CA Kingsnake
PostPosted: July 19th, 2017, 9:19 pm 
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Chad M. Lane wrote:
The debate and more so point fun, was about green, which is in fact a photogenic artifact.
Again beautiful kings man!
Find one you little shit!! :lol: :lol: ...until then, we ain't friends Lmfao


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