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 Post subject: Western Spadefoot population discovered - voucher sorting
PostPosted: May 23rd, 2017, 3:48 pm 
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Joined: March 19th, 2011, 6:43 pm
Posts: 1785
I just spent about an hour writing four long descriptive paragraphs... went to post the post... was automatically logged out... logged in...text...gone. :o
:oops: :oops: :oops: :oops: :oops: :oops: :oops: :oops: :oops: :oops: :oops: :oops: :oops: :oops:
This is the simplified version...

I found 113 spadefoot the first night in a place I haven't seen them before. Found while exploring a road I normally never cruise, because of low snake activity. Sacramento county. Because of possible recounts, I'll say 73. All the size of a quarter or slightly larger except for 2 adults. Also found a separate individual 3 miles from herd area.

2nd night, I returned to get an accurate count. These are the photos from the 2nd night. On the way home, I went by my diverse herping road that runs through some great habitat, that I scouted myself back in 2010. I had suspected they must be there but my main focus is to find a nightsnake voucher there. Found one lonely individual (toad with quarter) adult peacefully sitting in the road :thumb: Super stoked!! More important to me than the other finds because it confirmed my thoughts of the habitat. Also, it's a separate population. Far more rewarding than the random herd find :) I will check there for tigers later.

Does anyone know if there are any protected Spea study areas in Sacramento county? I don't see a database record for Sac County but I do see one on Calherps. I saw a guy parking a tractor behind the fenced off area where the breeding water is located. Also, the individual found 3 miles away on the first night, was traveling towards a construction site where tractor work had just begun. Should someone be notified about this? Does anyone have any info and if it's sensitive please feel free to PM me.

HELP ME FIND RECOUNTS? :thumb:
I was gonna sort through and then add these to the database but thought it would be a cool thing for herpers to take a stab at it as well. :mrgreen: It's not 116, thank god :lol: but, still is no easy task... All vouchers are from the 2nd night. any suggestions to fellow herpers to make this task easier are welcome. I found one already ( unique leg markings) ;) How many can you find?

I also found my morph for the year :thumb: Lacking his red spots and looks somewhat translucent. Does that qualify as pattern-less? Axanthic? Looks like an evolutionary step in the right direction in regards to camouflage to the road. Seems like the back legs fade right into the road coloring :crazyeyes:

There are two photos of the transparent morph and two of the separate population voucher (quarter). All other vouchers, same toad or not, have their own numeric label... A-D.... 1-10. Which numbers are the same toads?




Imageseperate population voucher by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageSeperate population voucher by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

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2nd night vouchers:

I DECIDED TO REMOVE TEMPS

ImageA1 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageA2 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageA2 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageA3 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageA4 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageA5 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageA6 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageA7 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageA8 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageA9 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageA10 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageB1 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageB2 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageB3 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageB4 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageB5 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageB6 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageB7 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageB8 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageB9 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageB10 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageC1 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageC2 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageC3 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageC4 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageC5 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageC6 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageC7 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageC8 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageC9 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageC10 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageD1 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageD2 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageD3 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageD4 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageD5 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageD6 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageD7 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageD8 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageD9 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageD10 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

I DECIDED TO REMOVE THE TEMPS




Other finds photographed:


ImageDSC_0965 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageDSC_0924 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageDSC_0902 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageDSC_0879 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageDSC_0883 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageDSC_0847 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

ImageDSC_0818 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr


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 Post subject: Re: Western Spadefoot population discovered - voucher sortin
PostPosted: May 25th, 2017, 8:13 pm 
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Joined: June 7th, 2010, 7:57 pm
Posts: 144
Location: Davis/Santa Cruz
Wow crazy variation! Over here on the other side of the valley they mostly just look green but those white ones are sick. Unfortunately, hammondii are only a CA special concern species, so while collecting is illegal they don't receive any habitat protection that federal listing grants. Additionally, the agriculture industry gets one of the biggest passes when it comes to converting land, so unless you went to the property owners and they turned out to be toad lovers and wanted to adjust their whole farming practices, there's not much you can do. They do probably benefit from a lot of the critical habitat designation that the ambystoma receive, as well as protection on some military bases so that's a silver lining I guess. As for voucher counting, the quantity field in the database is supposed to reflect the number of individuals shown in your attached voucher pictures. So unless you photographed and plan to upload all 100+ toads together you probably don't need to count to make a distinction between 75 or 100. You could put up ten pictures or so and include in the notes section that there were many more seen and not photographed.
-Elliot


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 Post subject: Re: Western Spadefoot population discovered - voucher sortin
PostPosted: May 26th, 2017, 12:39 am 
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Joined: March 19th, 2011, 6:43 pm
Posts: 1785
yoloherper wrote:
Wow crazy variation! Over here on the other side of the valley they mostly just look green but those white ones are sick. Unfortunately, hammondii are only a CA special concern species, so while collecting is illegal they don't receive any habitat protection that federal listing grants. Additionally, the agriculture industry gets one of the biggest passes when it comes to converting land, so unless you went to the property owners and they turned out to be toad lovers and wanted to adjust their whole farming practices, there's not much you can do. They do probably benefit from a lot of the critical habitat designation that the ambystoma receive, as well as protection on some military bases so that's a silver lining I guess. As for voucher counting, the quantity field in the database is supposed to reflect the number of individuals shown in your attached voucher pictures. So unless you photographed and plan to upload all 100+ toads together you probably don't need to count to make a distinction between 75 or 100. You could put up ten pictures or so and include in the notes section that there were many more seen and not photographed.
-Elliot


Thanks for the response Elliot! The place where I found the individual toad is right next to military protected habitat. Which is another reason why I was so glad to see that one. That was in the original 4 paragraphs :? It looked like the construction that had started was more along the lines of a business or housing development just starting up. Could be farming, but judging by the type of tractor I'm leaning more towards construction site. That sucks we can't really do anything. I think these guys are protected for the most part, for now. I just hope they don't dig up that pond area the herd was migrating from. Little Walkers arising from the dead Lol

Seriously! Those white ones are something else. Prettiest damn frogs I've ever seen. I found a couple fine grain sandy looking individuals on the first night. They look really cool! I took better shots of those and I'll probably include those into an end-of-year-post with a handful of snake in situs I managed to get earlier this year. Turns out I'll have a few photos to share after all.

Are the spades you mentioned in Sacramento county as well? Can you give any non-specific info without giving exact location? All of my finds were found near the far eastern side of the county that boarders El Dorado. I haven't seen any Tigers out there, but I seriously only looked one time while living in Folsom lol (no heater in my truck. Had to bypass the heatercore) I didn't do much rain cruising (2 or 3) and when I did I was more focus on Red-legged Frog habitat as opposed to cow ponds. I think I might be able to cruise one later this year. I know there are Tigers near Rancho Secco. My little brother installs solar panels and said he discovered 7 or 9 large adults this year buried deep in the ground after ripping up some foundation flooring structure on a guys property out there. The land owner said that they hadn't seen them in years because of the drought, but usually see them all over the yard, coming from the pond on their property. I imagine there are probably Spea in that area as well.

Haha No...way...in...hell...am I planning on uploading 100+ vouchers :lol: :lol: I didn't take vouchers that first night, just some shots of the best looking ones. which is why I went back the 2nd night to voucher the 40. I thought, no ones gonna believe I saw that many :lol: especially WHERE I saw them! I have about 4 photos from the first night that I plan on entering and then adding the extra note to the record like you mentioned. I did that before with another record I put in...couchi, I think. Someone gave me a heads up back then that the quantity has to match the number of photos added. I WAS gonna put the 40 in, but I was thinking about that today actually and thought... ummmm, yeah, naw, 10 is probably good enough. lol I'll just pick out the best displays of variation and add those. I'm glad you liked seeing that :beer: That was the best part of the experience for me. I was thinking man, no one except for maybe Fundad and the older guys have seen that many. The variation in color and pattern amazes me. Definately worth posting so the people on the forum can experience that as well. That's my favorite aspect about finding that many. The first one I found was actually a super small brown, kinda dull looking one, with red spots and I thought, wow...that is the prettiest looking Western toad I've seen. I'm gonna have to photograph this one...Lol It even hopped little bop hops and wasn't doing the distinctive crazy Spade-leaps that look like a treefrog on redbull...then, my next thought was. Didn't I see a tan tadpole out here one time and thought it was an aberrant treefrog...hummm, could this be a cross with Spea...? :lol: Then I saw a huge green adult about 20 feet up the road and was like... hole..lee...shit... :) wow :) Best amphibian experience so far for me! :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: Western Spadefoot population discovered - voucher sortin
PostPosted: May 28th, 2017, 1:10 pm 
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Joined: March 19th, 2011, 6:43 pm
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Ok, I just entered my database records :thumb: If there's and issue with any of the entries, let me know. I added pics of different individuals to show variation, for 1 toad vouchers. Not sure if you're supposed to do that or not.

RECOUNTS LIST:

A1 - C6
A4 - D3
A9 - C4
C2 - D8
C5 - A10


Each of these frogs were safely escorted off the road. They were at least 3 feet into the grass away from the road, before I moved on to voucher more toads. The recounts then turned around and returned back to the road. Why? You can see the humidity beading up on the toads. Collecting moisture for their summer dig? Do Spades urinate as they dig in order to moisten digging ground that is already too surface dry? It seemed very dry in this area and the toads didn't seem interested in flying and crawing bugs attracted to my flashlight an inch in front of their face. I don't know much about the species but they our my fav phibian now :thumb: They seem to be holding a water collecting posture similar to dung beetles in fog. Except absorbing through the skin, maybe...? Whatever it is, they seem content to sit in the road instead of amongst the protective canopy of dry grasses... clear open area = more moisture consumed? ..or does it just feel so gotched-dammed-good 8-)


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 Post subject: Re: Western Spadefoot population discovered - voucher sortin
PostPosted: June 3rd, 2017, 5:26 pm 
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Ok, so this was pretty cool. I when road cruising last night on my road. This time looking for a rhino. Saw a few little buzztails and to my surprise I found the exact same individual spea I had found the last time I was there, more than a week ago. In the EXACT same spot! (The quarter toad) I've observed this a lot with gigas basking areas, but this is a first amphibian sighting like this. Aside from Bullfrog maybe. When I was a kid, I do remember returning to the same spot in attempts to catch the same bullfrog. But I would have thought a land twelling toad would be more random in his ventures. He was literally no more than 2 feet from where I found him the first time. Cellphone voucher this time around, so light is affecting the color




Image20170602_223501 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr

Image20170602_223501 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr




I went back to the massive outbreak of spreading walker toads road to see if I would have the same result there as well and only saw about 20 this time around. I photographed ten, thinking I got a least one for sure that I saw before, but none were the same. This was a neat action capture tho....

Image20170602_231659 by California Reptile & Amphibian Appreciation, on Flickr


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