RFI: Utah DOR salvage and tissue samples

Dedicated exclusively to field herping.

Moderator: Scott Waters

Post Reply
DanW
Posts: 103
Joined: November 4th, 2010, 8:02 pm

RFI: Utah DOR salvage and tissue samples

Post by DanW »

Howdy,

Probably being over optimistic that I will encounter much herpetofauna and likely should just stick to fishing, but I have a few quick questions.

I was hoping some of the Utah residents could give me some quick insight into salvaging DOR specimens. As a non resident passing through next week do I need a state scientific permit to collect DORs? (most states seem to require one these days, but thought I would ask)
Anyone know if I can just collect a tissue sample?

I am purchasing a fishing license, does anyone have clarification on whether I can take any toe clips if I find live/dor amphibians.

I usually have more time to read into a states regulations, plan, and actually apply for the collecting permits I want. Decided on a whim last night to head out to Utah this weekend. Will be there Sunday through Wednesday.

If anyone knows whether or not I could get a salvage permit with basically no notice and who to contact that would be great.

Thanks for the help.

Dan
Brian Eagar
Posts: 430
Joined: June 7th, 2010, 12:59 pm

Re: RFI: Utah DOR salvage and tissue samples

Post by Brian Eagar »

Hi Dan, Here is the lowdown on the rules we have. (note that we worked very hard years ago to get this far as historically salvage of controlled species was illegal).

1. You can salvage DOR Non-Controlled species up to your posession limit (usually 3 in a calendar year) and those you could take home with you without any hassle. Live or dead non-controlled animals can be exported up to your collection / posession limit.

2. You can salvage DOR Controlled status species but they must be submitted to the Utah Division of Wildlife Native Aquatics division in Salt Lake City within one month of salvaging them. At the end of the year such specimens are transfered to the BYU Bean Life Science museum for preservation in the museum collection there. The individuals involved in that effort have been trying to amass a tissue collection from specimens before pickling them but resources to manage that tissue collection and the permits involved have grown prohibiting in my understanding.

3. Any deviation from the above requires a Certificate of Registration (COR) with specific allowances approved and spelled out on the permit. This includes by definition tissue samples.

4. Fishing and hunting licenses have nothing to do with herps in Utah despite proposals we have put forth in the past.

5. Collecting prohibited species is prohibited without a COR and approval of such a COR is highly unlikely.

You didn't mention what specific species you were interested in taking tissue samples of.
That would help to clarify what you are hoping to do. Let me know if you have any questions.

I'm trying to be as helpful as possible here and wheras I'm documenting it here on the forum hopefully others can search for this info later. However, I take no responsibility for you not taking the time to read and understand the rules yourself.
I just have the benefit of sitting through countless meetings and reviewing many drafts of this document before it was ultimately approved in its current form years ago.
If you like reading and interpreting legal documents you can asses my interpretation above by reading this document:
http://www.rules.utah.gov/publicat/code ... 57-053.htm

Here is a table of the species instead of paragraphs of text stating their status which you can use to understand what is non-controlled, controlled and prohibited.
http://wildlife.utah.gov/guidebooks/amp ... _reptiles/
DanW
Posts: 103
Joined: November 4th, 2010, 8:02 pm

Re: RFI: Utah DOR salvage and tissue samples

Post by DanW »

Thanks Brian,

I appreciate the links and your interpretation. Not targeting anything specific, most reptile and amphibian loan requests I get throughout the year are for tissue samples these days. So, if I know I'm traveling somewhere interesting out of state or to a place that likely has not been sampled particularly well I collect tissue samples and voucher photographs.

I hate seeing a good DOR specimen go to waste!

Thanks,
Dan
Jimi
Posts: 1955
Joined: December 3rd, 2010, 12:06 pm

Re: RFI: Utah DOR salvage and tissue samples

Post by Jimi »

Thanks Brian, for helping Dan so quickly & so well. My only quibble would be about the museum's tissue collection - Jack has told folks the new/under-construction Bean facility will curate tissues (in a couple of years), and that he's still taking tissues, and on a side note I'm not aware the permit stuff has grown prohibitive for him. I actually had someone from another museum contact him, offering to be the destination for tissue specimens, and that fellow was waved off. This was in July 2013. I only bring this stuff up so as not to de-motivate local people from harvesting tissues from DORs that don't merit a whole-body salvage, yet are still identifiable.

Dan - I work for UDWR and can get you contact info for the "rules & permits" folks, if you ever come back with a little more planning - and some lead time - & want to pursue permits. Just to clarify, my work here has ZERO to do with rules & permits for anything (trout, herps, deer whatever).

Good on ya for the salvage effort. I wish more people did it. It could be easier.

Cheers,
Jimi
Brian Eagar
Posts: 430
Joined: June 7th, 2010, 12:59 pm

Re: RFI: Utah DOR salvage and tissue samples

Post by Brian Eagar »

No problem Dan. Thanks for the clarification on the current tissue situation Jimi. Where I missed the pickle parties last year I guess I'm not up-to-speed. Thanks for correcting me and point noted on significant tissues.

Dan what I typically tell people like you that are passing through and are mindful of the benefit of salvaging animals is,
pick up the animal (assuming controlled species), send me an email (Jimi would probably be just as receptive) and let me know what you have and I would do my best to meet with you and get the animal(s) and locality info for transfer to the museum.
I am permitted to directly hand that stuff over to the museum as is Jimi.
I hate to see a good DOR go to waste also. Especially if it's significant by way of elevation, habitat, range or is gravid or full of a prey item. There are several non-controlled species which despite having large ranges and populations in the state may be under-represented in museum collections due to their secretive nature or for which additional locality data would similarly be important to scoop up such as:
Diadophis, Charina, and Rinochelius fall into the secretive widespread category.
Masticophis in the eastern part of the state and Coluber in the southern half of the state would fall into the could use additional specimens category.

Brian
Post Reply