Need tripod purchasing tips, please!

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Hans Breuer (twoton)
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Need tripod purchasing tips, please!

Post by Hans Breuer (twoton) »

Hi all,

I'm thinking of getting more into plant and landscape photography, and of generally using the flash less during daytime (I shoot mostly in dark forests). I'm looking for something highly flexible and light. Also important is that I can put it flat on the ground to shoot terrestrial things eye-to-eye.

Thanks in advance for all your tips!

Cheers

Hans
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Stohlgren
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Re: Need tripod purchasing tips, please!

Post by Stohlgren »

Spend the money and get carbon fiber. If your tripod is too heavy you will never bring it along and it will be a waste of money. Fewer leg segments will make the tripod lighter, too (but it will be taller when collapsed).

I have the Manfrotto MA190CXPRO3 (current version is MT190XPRO3), which has a center column. It adds weight and I have never found it to be useful. I wish I would have gotten the version without the center column. Gitzo is well known for their tripods, and worth looking into, but they are very expensive (but should last forever).
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Re: Need tripod purchasing tips, please!

Post by MonarchzMan »

I have a Gitzo Explorer and absolutely love it. It's carbon fiber and has a center column that can be angled any which way. I have found this very useful for a variety of angles that other tripods simply cannot get. It's not cheap, but definitely worth the money.
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chrish
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Re: Need tripod purchasing tips, please!

Post by chrish »

Hmm...tripods....here are some (long) musings....

I have probably half a dozen good tripods from various manufacturers. The lesson I have learned from 30 years of tripod buying is buy a decent one the first time. A good tripod is one of those things that makes you think "wow, why didn't I buy this before". That said, keep in mind that a tripod you leave at home or in the car is worthless. If it isn't field friendly enough to take with you, why buy it? Big heavy tripods are great for studio work but not for field herping or plant photos.

Unfortunately, buying a tripod for herping/plants is going to be a compromise between flexibility to the ground vs. sturdiness. You just have to get the one that best fits your specific needs.

Material:
I agree about Carbon Fiber. It is worth the extra money because it is not only lighter, but it dampens vibrations better. Of course, read the specs carefully. I've seen carbon fiber tripods that were only 10% lighter than the aluminum (at twice the price!) because the fittings and head made up most of the weight.

Brands:
- Gitzo tripods are outstanding, I just think they are overpriced. I don't own any for this reason. It isn't that I wouldn't buy one, I just think there are cheaper alternatives.

- Manfrotto make good tripods that are tough to kill. I have one that is about 20 years old that has served me well. It is a big aluminum model that is quite heavy but very sturdy. I wouldn't hesitate to purchase any of their better tripods.

- In the last 10 years or so I have been using two carbon fiber Benro tripods (BenRo as opposed to BenBo. Benbo make good tripods, but they are expensive as well). Benro tripods are manufactured in China and were made to compete with the other high end brands. Mine are very well made. When they first came on the market they were amazingly cheap (I bought the equivalent of a $500 Gitzo/Manfrotto for under $100). Now the prices have come up a bit, but they are still a good buy IMHO. Mine have taken a beating in real field situations for years and have held up great. I certainly recommend looking at them for bang for the buck.

- For travel, I bought a cheap MePhoto travel tripod that folds down to around 12 inches. I looked at the aluminum vs CF and found that the CF was barely lighter at the price. It is a great little travel tripod for the price (under $150 US). It is very well made and you can buy a short column for it to lay it flat on the ground. It isn't going to hold a 500mm lens, but it is sturdy for the size and well made unlike a lot of other similar priced travel tripods.

- Beware the "Flashpoint" tripods that Adorama camera sells inexpensively. A friend of mine bought one of the "high end" models and the fittings crapped out within a year.

Height:
- I generally won't buy a tripod that doesn't come up to my head height (with ball head and camera on it) without the center column. That means I want a tripod that can reach at least 56" by itself. The ball head/camera brings it up close to eye level. I do have some travel tripods that are shorter than that, but I get frustrated sometimes that I can't get them to full height. For landscape photos, being able to get high enough off the ground can make a difference on the type of photo you can compose.

Leg Sections:
If you are deciding about 3, 4 or 5 section legs, there are a few issues to consider. 4/5 section tripods are a pain to put up, but easier to carry and travel with. Another equally important considering, particularly for ground level photography is the amount of spread of the feet when you have it flattened out on the ground. If you have three long legs sections and you splay those out they are sticking out several feet in all directions. This means they get tangled in vegetation, bump into logs/rocks and just add to the complexity of trying to get that low shot. If you have 5 section legs, they are shorter when folded up and easier to manipulate in dense vegetation or over uneven ground.
An alternative to this is to get a shorter "ground pod" that you can use for you low level photography. They can be very helpful for plants, etc.

So, all that aside, I think the most important thing to consider is not the legs but the head of your tripod. Buying a good ball head is as important if not more important than the quality of legs that go under it.. Get a good ball head that has a ball that is at least as big as a golf ball and if you have heavy gear a ball head the size of a tennis ball is even better. The bigger the ball, the easier it is to manipulate and fine tune the position. Get a ball head with three adjustments (rotation of the head independent of the ball, movement of the ball itself, and adjustment of the tension on the ball).

I think about the ball head/tripod head the way I think about lenses. Buying expensive tripod legs and putting cheap tripod head on is like buying a great camera body and buying the cheapest lenses you can. You just won't be happy. A good ball head can cost several hundred dollars, but you will only buy it once. You will replace the legs under it several times before you replace the head. My ball head cost more than and weighs more than my tripod legs but I wouldn't trade it for the world. Mine is made by Really Right Stuff but Kirk and most tripod manufacturers make good ones as well.

Get a tripod head that that uses the Arca-Swiss type mount. That way you aren't tied in to a particular tripod manufacturers quick release system. And buy a couple of extra quick release plates. I have one on each of my camera bodies, on my spotting scope, and on my lenses that have tripod collars (and my microphone bracket for frog recording). That way I can switch from one to the other on my tripod in a couple of seconds without having to unscrew anything.

Sorry for the long winded reply, but those are my musings.

Chris
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Re: Need tripod purchasing tips, please!

Post by bgorum »

This is what I use- http://www.fieldherpforum.com/forum/vie ... itzo+g1340. Somehow this review is not listed in the sticky at the top of this forum. I use it with a Kirk BH-1 ballhead. I use this for nearly every picture I take and can say I am 100% satisfied with its performance. Its relatively light, very stable, and just plain works like it should. Gitzos are expensive, but worth every penny in my opinion.
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chrish
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Re: Need tripod purchasing tips, please!

Post by chrish »

bgorum wrote:This is what I use- http://www.fieldherpforum.com/forum/vie ... itzo+g1340. Somehow this review is not listed in the sticky at the top of this forum.
That's because the guy who puts them up there missed this.... :oops:
It's there now!
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Hans Breuer (twoton)
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Re: Need tripod purchasing tips, please!

Post by Hans Breuer (twoton) »

Wow ... again, thank you all very much for the awesome help! Much food for thought! I've looked around the website of my local supplier, and this one caught my eye.. I like the travel aspect. I just can't find out how low this actually goes. Does anyone know (or is anyone able to see) how close to the ground I can put the camera? I always carry a GorillaPod anyway, so if this Manfrotto model doesn't allow ultra-low levels, the Gorilla will help.

EDIT: Never mind the Gorilla, this one seems to be just the ticket. Now I just need a nice ball head...
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Re: Need tripod purchasing tips, please!

Post by Stohlgren »

That is the slightly sturdier and taller version of the Manfrotto I own (except mine is a 3-section). I think you'd be happy with it. Like I said above, I don't like the center column and would get the model without it if I could do it over again. When you want it to go low (which is most of the time in my case), you have to move it to the horizontal position. Not a big deal but becomes annoying over time since it hasn't actually provided any benefits for my style of shooting and adds weight. Another poster said they like the center column, though, so obviously it is up to your taste and shooting style.

The ball head I use is a Markins Q-Ball Q3 Emille. It is small and lightweight but more than sturdy enough form my 70-400mm, and it has all the adjustments that chrish mentioned were important in a good ball head.

I also would recommend getting and L-bracket. Makes shooting vertical easier and allows you to get very low by locking in on the side of the camera and rotating the ball head to the side, like this photo from bgorum's post:
bgorum wrote:Image
-Kevin
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chrish
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Re: Need tripod purchasing tips, please!

Post by chrish »

Stohlgren wrote:I also would recommend getting and L-bracket. Makes shooting vertical easier and allows you to get very low by locking in on the side of the camera and rotating the ball head to the side, like this photo from bgorum's post:
Excellent point! L-brackets rock! I need to look and see if they make them for my current camera since I hadn't looked in a while.
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Re: Need tripod purchasing tips, please!

Post by Stohlgren »

You have the A77 II, right? This is the bracket I have for my A77:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/8 ... _base.html
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Re: Need tripod purchasing tips, please!

Post by chrish »

Stohlgren wrote:You have the A77 II, right? This is the bracket I have for my A77:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/8 ... _base.html
I looked at the RRS website but was wondering if the plate for the A77 would fit. I'll have to do some side by side comparisons online.
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Re: Need tripod purchasing tips, please!

Post by Hans Breuer (twoton) »

I love that photo of the tripod and the rattlesnake. Alien scout vessel meets Earthling. Scout vessel deploys huge outboard camera plus mobile video screen.

"We come in peace."
"Hissssssssss."
"Take us to your leader."
"Hisssssssssssssss."

Et cetera, ad nauseam...

Closer to topic, thank you all very much again - I've ordered the Manfrotto and a matching head. We'll see what it all leads to :-)
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Re: Need tripod purchasing tips, please!

Post by Stohlgren »

chrish wrote:I looked at the RRS website but was wondering if the plate for the A77 would fit. I'll have to do some side by side comparisons online.
I believe the bodies are identical, so it should fit. But I could be wrong. It doesn't look like RRS makes this bracket anymore, so you'd have to get it second hand.
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Re: Need tripod purchasing tips, please!

Post by jimoo742 »

Hans Breuer (twoton) wrote:
EDIT: Never mind the Gorilla, this one seems to be just the ticket. Now I just need a nice ball head...


I have this, or a similar one (not at home) with the horizontal bar. Great help for frogs and salamanders low to the ground.
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Re: Need tripod purchasing tips, please!

Post by VAS »

Spend once and cry once. Dont let the price be the deciding factor.

VAS
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Hans Breuer (twoton)
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Re: Need tripod purchasing tips, please!

Post by Hans Breuer (twoton) »

VAS wrote:Spend once and cry once.
LOVE IT! :-)
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Re: Need tripod purchasing tips, please!

Post by dthor68 »

I have bought 4 tripods since 2007. The first three, Giottos, Slik and Manfrotto lasted all of 2 years. The Giottos and Slik were nice at first but after a couple of months became loose to were they just flop around. If I tighten them they get all loose within a couple hours of use. I have sent them both back for repairs, a month later they were loose again. There is nothing more aggravating than a tripod that flops around! The Manfrotto stayed tight for more than a year. However, once when setting up in the mud I pushed it down in the mud to get more stable ground and a leg broke off. One thing I will say about all three is they have great customer service.

In 2009 I spent 400.00 on a heavy aluminum Gitzo tripod (LegsOnly). Despite what someone else said about not using a heavy tripod, I use this all the time, everywhere! I have set it up in the Chattooga River hundreds of times, it is so heavy that the waters flow does not even phase it. I have been using this Gitzo tripod for 6 years and it is still tight as crap! Chances are you wont get the Gitzo, eventually you will.
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Re: Need tripod purchasing tips, please!

Post by Hans Breuer (twoton) »

Thanks, dthor68! Food for thought. I went with the Manfrotto in the end ... I'm not good with schlepping around heavy stuff. That said, I have a tripod my father used back in the day to mount his Hasselblad/500 mm Zeiss TeleTessar combo. The tripod feels like it's made of cast iron, it weighs an estimated six tons, but I've gotten marvelous results with it, wherever I could drive up to the shooting place ....
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Re: Need tripod purchasing tips, please!

Post by John Martin »

dthor68 wrote:The first three, Giottos, Slik and Manfrotto lasted all of 2 years. The Giottos and Slik were nice at first but after a couple of months became loose to were they just flop around. If I tighten them they get all loose within a couple hours of use. I have sent them both back for repairs, a month later they were loose again.
I've only purchased one tripod in my life, a Slik Universal 212AF back in 1989. It's a 3 section leg design with a "pistol grip" type head. I still use it for macro photography to this day and have never had a problem with it. It IS a bit heavy for field use but seems sturdy enough - again, I'm no expert on tripods but this unit has served me well. I think it was ~ $90 in '89. Is Slik still made in Japan? If it went to China maybe that could be a problem. Hans, congrats on the new toy! :beer:

Here is a link to a pic of it...

http://www.gmcamera.com/slik-universal- ... caddy.html
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Re: Need tripod purchasing tips, please!

Post by chrish »

John Martin wrote:
dthor68 wrote:The first three, Giottos, Slik and Manfrotto lasted all of 2 years. The Giottos and Slik were nice at first but after a couple of months became loose to were they just flop around. If I tighten them they get all loose within a couple hours of use. I have sent them both back for repairs, a month later they were loose again.
I've only purchased one tripod in my life, a Slik Universal 212AF back in 1989. It's a 3 section leg design with a "pistol grip" type head. I still use it for macro photography to this day and have never had a problem with it. It IS a bit heavy for field use but seems sturdy enough - again, I'm no expert on tripods but this unit has served me well. I think it was ~ $90 in '89. Is Slik still made in Japan? If it went to China maybe that could be a problem. Hans, congrats on the new toy! :beer:

Here is a link to a pic of it...

http://www.gmcamera.com/slik-universal- ... caddy.html
That's funny. I have the same tripod that I bought about 5 years before yours although I added the pistol grip later. It is a very dependable tripod, but it doesn't get as low as my other tripods which is why it is in my closet at the moment. But I will agree about it being tough to kill and stable.
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Re: Need tripod purchasing tips, please!

Post by Trey »

What about something like this for what we do? http://www.reallyrightstuff.com/Shop/Al ... ripod.html

Also, when shopping for tripods online where can one find how low to the ground the tripod will go? I was looking at several of these manfrotto's and benbo's mentioned in this thread and can't seem to see in the specs a "minimum" height, although maximum height seems to be listed... Thanks.
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Re: Need tripod purchasing tips, please!

Post by chrish »

Trey wrote:What about something like this for what we do? http://www.reallyrightstuff.com/Shop/Al ... ripod.html
That RRS ground pod has always looked interesting to me. Kirk photo makes a similar ground pod called the Mighty Low Boy (http://www.kirkphoto.com/Mighty-Low-Boy.html) which someone on this forum used to use and love. I don't remember who it was though. I think the Mighty Low Boy is cheaper than the RRS ground pod. (Here's some opinions about comparing them - http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/27653959)

The only thing that holds me back from buying one (other than the fact that I own 6 tripods already :oops: ) is that it is somewhat limiting. Sometimes you want a habitat shot that requires some height off the ground.
Also, when shopping for tripods online where can one find how to the ground the tripod will go? I was looking at several of these manfrotto's and benbo's mentioned in this thread and can't seem to see in the specs a "minimum" height, although maximum height seems to be listed... Thanks.
If you look on sites like BHPhotovideo.com, under the specifications they list they usually list the minimum height. Remember this is often just the height of the tripod itself, the ball head is another several inches high.
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